Up front design fees?

[lilypoo 12]

I started out making up quick proofs for potential clients with no charge up front and it was working for me for a while.  Now that I'm busier I don't feel like I have the time to do the artwork for free up front, especially if it's complicated.  Especially, especially after having done some detailed logos and never hearing back. 

 

Problem is that I have a lot of trouble quoting jobs without first making at least a rough proof for me. 

 

I also continue to encounter people who claim they need to "see" what the decal will look like before committing.  If it's just text, I don't really have a problem showing them a watermarked proof but if I have to trace/clean-up a logo, I don't want to do that no-charge.

 

Any ideas on how to handle this?   Asking for an up-front design fee in certain cases has not been well-received. 

[security802 686]

50% deposit before any work begins. Is how I do all now. Any that have questioned me on it, I just point out they have to pay 100% for any order online. Polite, respectful and explain reasoning usually smooths ruffled feathers

[lilypoo 12]

So you are able to determine the final cost before you even sketch it out?   That's one of my issues I think...I have to SEE it to price it.  I'm hoping in time I'll get better at not having to do that.  I still get the "I don't know if I'll like it so I don't want to pay anything in advance" thing.  I met a gal who does blinged-out shirts...she charges a $25 artwork fee before she'll show a proof, and it seems to be working for her.

[security802 686]

So you are able to determine the final cost before you even sketch it out?   That's one of my issues I think...I have to SEE it to price it.  I'm hoping in time I'll get better at not having to do that.  I still get the "I don't know if I'll like it so I don't want to pay anything in advance" thing.  I met a gal who does blinged-out shirts...she charges a $25 artwork fee before she'll show a proof, and it seems to be working for her.

That's a good way too. Most of my stuff is pretty straight forward on what they want, makes easy to price on the fly. I also tell em I do not charge design fee if they order from me. However if they want the art work to go to someone else, say for biz cards I charge a fee. I also put on the invoice it is for use on products I do not sell.

[pshawny 410]

Time is money. Where else can you go and have custom work done without paying upfront or putting down a deposit? If someone isn't willing to put down a 50% deposit, then they aren't serious about buying.

 

At graphic design websites, customers plop down hundreds of dollars upfront to see different designs and then have to choose one.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

I've avoided this for years but alas the times are changing and I feel the need to catch up so I'm thinking if a copy leaves the store either in person or email that I'll ask for a non refundable deposit that will be applied to any work we end up doing. That way I can still say free design but at least get something up front.

[skarekrow 1,842]

I've avoided this for years but alas the times are changing and I feel the need to catch up so I'm thinking if a copy leaves the store either in person or email that I'll ask for a non refundable deposit that will be applied to any work we end up doing. That way I can still say free design but at least get something up front.

That's the way I do it... You gotta Pay to Play!

 

(We all need to stand our ground on this one.)

[Wildgoose 4,200]

I operate based on the implied potential for volume. If it is someone who just wants one shirt with a whole bunch of design then I tell them they will have to pay my hourly rate to build it ($25/hr which I think is fairly cheap). If they are wanting a good sized order then I usually tell them I will do basic design work as part of the order as long as they order X amount of product. If they have no idea what they want like a new business or something then I offer a "Design Package" for $250 which basically is ten hours of my time 3 of which will be devoted to file conversion and misc at the end and I put it all on a cheap thumb drive and hand it over with a signed copyright release that allows joint ownership of the design. I tell them ahead of time that I will let them know if they are going to go over the 7 hours of design time and so far only one has even come close. I am also careful to take my time in responding to tweaks and changes even though I may bust them out in 10 or 15 minutes I don't send it back until the next morning or way late at night like at midnight. I don't consider that misleading but it helps to accentuate the need to make focused decisions rather than just asking to what this or that might look like on a whim. 

 

If they don't act like they want to spend the money on a full design I will usually concede to do a quick draw up to get them a sign or shirts but they won't get to own the design. If they allow you time to explain all the why and why not's then they usually decide that they do want the package. 

[gcextreme 475]

Your'e not gonna be able to please every "potential" customer...

Someone isn't an official "customer" until they provide you some payment to show they are committed.

Until they prove they are committed, they are only a "potential" customer and may be just wasting your time.

Your time is valuable, and shouldn't be wasted on "iffy" potential customers.

Show them examples of your work, its quality, and if they are still un-decided, tell them to contact you later when they decide.

I had a potential customer wanting me to make a decal outline of his bike...i showed him samples of others i did. Then told him i would need $20 down for a design deposit fee. He said he would pay me "after" i drew it up and showed him.

I said..NOPE i dont design and spend several hours without a deposit. He walked away. Too many times i wasted hours drawing something up for a potential customer and they backed out or never got back to me.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

+1 - I have to agree - to many times doing work and not getting paid.  you will keep your sanity when you figure out that not everyone makes a great customer.  some are great, some you tolerate and some just aren't worth the bother

[gcextreme 475]

I hated working in retail, they used to say "the customer is always right"...

well NO the customer isn't always right, and they are only a customer if they are actually doing business and buying from you, if they are wasting your time and just causing problems, then they aren't worth it.

I had a customer once come and ask me, where the workshop aprons were, i politely walked him over to the aisle, and showed him. Next thing i know he was yelling and cussing at me calling me a communist because the aprons were made in China. Also this was back in 2002, and my brother a US Marine was over fighting in Iraq. My work uniform had a US Flag on the shoulder, and this "so called customer" was pointing at it, saying i didn't deserve to wear that flag cuz i was a f'n communist selling chinnese made stuff.

Well i opend up on the guy...told him welcome to america, you have the freedom to buy it or not, and we have the freedom to stock it in our store! He demanded to see the manager, i called the manager, and the guy gave the manager an ear full of bullcrap and the manager had security escort him out. Next thing i knew the manager was blaming and repramanding me for it!

He said the customer is always right, i said "f*&^ that, when the customer calls me a communist and anti-american, hes damn wrong!"

[mabscotthandyman 1,410]

I even had a customer called the Handyman service wanting an estimate the dumb person started by saying we will do the repairs ( heavy snow load damage ) we just need to get estimates for the insurance company I explained I charged $150.00 + $9.00 tax or a total of $159.00 they didnt think they should pay for an estimate even after I explained that the insurance would reimburse them those charges. The lady said we will call someone else I wish her good luck and hang up. They actually call back later willing to pay for the estimate but I politely declined.