Pricing Question

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Wasn't happy with a quarter each, who would be but there was a bigger picture to be seen. And yeah all said and done I'm happy with the outcome. I picked up the nickname when I moved to SC 9 years ago. Second job I has was a parts puller in a late model junk yard and they stated calling me jaybird over the radio to avoid confusion with some of the other guys names. It stuck.

[mopar691 281]

Wow, I do 1" x 3" (mean size) dealer decals for a average of 1.65 each across 17 different dealerships. According to Estimate I did a tad over 2500 pcs last year. At them numbers thats a $3500 difference. 

 

I admit I do price higher than most here and if I am working on something I have to be bring in a min per hour or I am losing money. My business model does not undercut to just get a job. If I do I am losing money. Time is better spent pounding the pavement and getting new customers for me than taking a beating on a job in the hopes I will get more work out of them.

 

Plus from my experience once you low-ball them to get the work that low pricing becomes expected on all future work or they go back to the local hack who was giving them the just material pricing to start with. 

 

Myself I price every job to make money. If im not meeting my minium I simply do not quote it or do it. I will not lose money to produce product. 

[skarekrow 1,842]

 Time is better spent pounding the pavement and getting new customers for me than taking a beating on a job in the hopes I will get more work out of them.

 

Plus from my experience once you low-ball them to get the work that low pricing becomes expected on all future work or they go back to the local hack who was giving them the just material pricing to start with. 

 

Ain't that the Truth there, Mopar, ain't it the Truth. If I had a dollar for every time some one mentioned more work in the future, or a buddy or relative with some other project... I'd be a weathy man. 

 

"So, can you knock off a little mentioning you?" or, "This will be a great one for your portfolio!"

[jaybyrd 3,770]

When in an area with limited opportunity you need to grab what you can get. And I didn't undercut just matched written estimate albeit my were cut and estimate was for print. Town of 800 and more small towns around me so only so many customers to go around.

[jfought 120]

Wow, I do 1" x 3" (mean size) dealer decals for a average of 1.65 each across 17 different dealerships. According to Estimate I did a tad over 2500 pcs last year. At them numbers thats a $3500 difference. 

 

I admit I do price higher than most here and if I am working on something I have to be bring in a min per hour or I am losing money. My business model does not undercut to just get a job. If I do I am losing money. Time is better spent pounding the pavement and getting new customers for me than taking a beating on a job in the hopes I will get more work out of them.

 

Plus from my experience once you low-ball them to get the work that low pricing becomes expected on all future work or they go back to the local hack who was giving them the just material pricing to start with. 

 

Myself I price every job to make money. If im not meeting my minium I simply do not quote it or do it. I will not lose money to produce product. 

Good for you!!!! great advise!! now if we could get the rest of the "sign Makers" to understand this concept we would all make money! it is NOT a race to the bottom price it is a race to see who can make the most money and if you undercut the next guy by 75% you just killed the market by that and it will take you going out of business to get the market back.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

When in an area with limited opportunity you need to grab what you can get. And I didn't undercut just matched written estimate albeit my were cut and estimate was for print. Town of 800 and more small towns around me so only so many customers to go around.

NO undercut, just different product in my case. Truth is if you spend your days undercutting everybody you'll be out of business the first time you have an equipment failure and haven't made the money to replace it. Low ballers tend to put themselves out of business within the first 2 years. I'm 5 years in and having my best year to date.

[mopar691 281]

Not to argue but your undercutting yourself with the price matching.

 

For a 1 x 3 decal, if your using cast which you should be, you have approx 18 cents in vinyl (If buying by 50 yard rolls) and about 5 cents in transfer tape ( with the waste around them for ganging and edges, etc. etc). So since you do not count time your total profit on a 500 piece order was 10 bucks. Is that even enough to run the lights long enough to weed them?

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Calendered and done out of strip in the bin that if not used end up in trash. You are correct in the profit on the 1 job and I may need to rephrase that, I did this job with a 90% chance of picking up more work from it and no this is not something I would do everyday. This job directly led to 50 shirts a month later and 3 for sure leads that generated full price work. All I'm saying is sometimes you gotta give a little to get a lot. And if I hadn't done that during our slowest time of year I would agree 100% on the time involved but if I hadn't done it who do I charge for twittling my thumbs for 10 hours hoping for a job to come in.

[sleeveofwizzard 104]

A customer wanted me to match the price of his usual decal guy on a commercial vehicle lettering job. $120 lower than my price that I thought was a little low already. I told him I would match the price but that means I am going to match the quality of work and materials as well. Then explained the difference between cast and cal. vinyl and how the lettering wasn't welded or straight. Showed him about 15 screw ups on the example car. Also the guy he hired to do it had charged him a fee for the artwork that is readily available on the internet and was a poor quality image that he didn't even give to the customer. Once I explained that I was going to have to do the same graphic work the last guy did and use more expensive materials, AND do a better job at all of it, he changed his tone.  

[WHIT72 36]

A one-off, 7 inch, calendered vinyl decal, with design services and app tape applied, ready to install?

 

$ 20 flat rate and I'll give you an extra, free one, to boot.

 

Gonna take every bit of half an hour, start to finish.

Isnt this a markup of about 2000% percent

 

What design services?

 

Im new and all, but Im not trying to rob anyone either.

 

Wouldnt this design COST with vinyl and application tape maybe a buck to make? 

 

Im sorry maybe Im missing something.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Isnt this a markup of about 2000% percent

 

What design services?

 

Im new and all, but Im not trying to rob anyone either.

 

Wouldnt this design COST with vinyl and application tape maybe a buck to make? 

 

Im sorry maybe Im missing something.

Some of us are "graphic artists" and charge accordingly, some of us are "that sticker guy" and charge accordingly. Most days I'm the latter but occasionally I'll get creative and suck some extra money out of em.

[OWJones 1,981]

Isnt this a markup of about 2000% percent

 

What design services?

 

Im new and all, but Im not trying to rob anyone either.

 

Wouldnt this design COST with vinyl and application tape maybe a buck to make? 

 

Im sorry maybe Im missing something.

 

How much is your time worth?  If someone wants a one-off (meaning custom design specific to them) decal, and they expect you to lay it out and cut it for them, then you need to charge them for your time.  If it takes you 30 minutes to lay out their design, adjust the size, pick the colors, tweak any nodes, etc., and then another 15-20 minutes to load up the vinyl, cut it out, weed it and tape it, then you've got at least 45 minutes of your time invested.  If you want to charge someone the equivalent of minimum wage to cover your time, then go work at McDonalds or some place that will appreciate having you work for minimum wage.

 

Add in more to cover wear and tear on your equipment, the cost of electricity to keep everything running, the cost of the scrap involved in creating their single 7" decal (unless you conveniently stock 8" wide rolls!), the pro-rated cost of your weeding tools, rulers, etc. plus the cost of vinyl and app tape.

 

If you spend nearly an hour of your's and your equipment's time on a single decal for someone and try to sell it for just the cost of vinyl, then you're losing money - big time.

 

I am *not* one of those people who won't look at a job for anything less than $50 - and there are people like that on these forums.   There are far too many people on ebay selling vinyl decals for barely more than the cost of vinyl + S&H - they may think they're doing well and making it up in volume and they are probably showing a small profit - until they sit down and do the math and realize they worked 150 hours this month and sold 700 decals with a profit of $0.50 each and they actually ended up working for $2.33 per hour...