printers are sexy

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

Was thinking while camping this weekend about if I would buy another printer - this was started when I had a printer hiccup last week (solved thank goodness)  and the bottom line is you pay $13000 for a sp300i (small printer) + laminator and after you spend about $20,000 in printer, laminator, material and ink to pay it all off before breaking even (takes about that much in ink and vinyl/laminate beyond the printer) . . . I am not sure I would because after it is paid off in a couple of years you might get another couple of years before you do it all again . . . . That is calculated that if you sell $800 a month of printed material your first 2 years is spent breaking even to be back where you was 2 years earlier before you spent the money in the first place.   Now if you can sell $1600 a month then maybe it would be worth it but that is a lot more than I sell on a part time basis. and that is relying on that amount every month even during the slow times.  now add in a couple of heads over the 4 years and other maint parts (cap tops, wipers, pumps, etc) and does it really make financial sense in the long run?  I hope my printer with proper maint will get me quite some time to come but if the worse happened . . .  .I'm not sure personally.  Just thinking out loud  

personally I am in deep so I have to keep going on this one but if I was to do it again  does it make financial sense or do we buy into the sexiness of the printers.  It's like being drawn to the rocks by the mermaids maybe.

[WHIT72 36]

I thought about buying a printer, but I also only do this part time. Vinyl cutting cost basically nothing to get started so I went that route. MMy wife isn't going to let me drop 20 grand on a printer that's going to sit in my basement half the time doing nothing. I also don't financially want to be a slave to this either.

As it stands now, I work when I want, I like that aspect. Plus I can think of about thirty or so better things to spend that kind of money on. Maybe some day but definitely not today.

My aspiration is to have a t shirt brand, something small, local with a solid following. I'm not looking to get filthy rich, just wealthy lol.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

I'm still drawn in but the realistic side of it is for the amount of print I would do breaking even every month would be a best case scenario. But I keep looking telling myself if I by it the work will magically follow.

[knucklehead 530]

Mimaki 54 inch print/cut is 11 grand. New affordable laminator 2-4 grand. Couple rolls of material, 2 grand.

 

If one was to buy a 54 inch graphtec, and say 40-50 rolls of 48 inch 3M vinyl, what would be the price difference?

 

And you still wouldn't have the right shade of blue, the lady is wanting.

[WHIT72 36]

I don't need a graphic. I'm pretty sure I can get just about any color someone is looking for. On the occasion I can't ill send them to someone who can. Like I said I'm part time, I don't nor do I have to accept every job and I prefer it that way.

[slice&dice 2,450]

Sexy?

Yep.

 

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

Mimaki 54 inch print/cut is 11 grand. New affordable laminator 2-4 grand. Couple rolls of material, 2 grand.

 

If one was to buy a 54 inch graphtec, and say 40-50 rolls of 48 inch 3M vinyl, what would be the price difference?

 

And you still wouldn't have the right shade of blue, the lady is wanting.

ahhh but there is the catch - that mutoh and laminator is basically the same price as I mentioned but it will take another 6-7 grand in vinyl and ink before you pay for all the materials and the equipment . . . .you won't break even until you have made the 20 grand to pay it all back before really making any money yourself.   it was just one of those things I was thinking thru after the fact - it is cool and does some really cool things but the practicality is you are working for 2 years for nothing before you make that money you wanted to make.

The other side of the coin is all the people that spend what they can on a used machine then find they need to spend a lot or what they can't afford to bring it up to an truly acceptable level.  Or buy the wrong equipment for the job and put out sub par work that doesn't last.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

PS Slice - I agree with that one and the routers!

[slice&dice 2,450]

I have a story that probably is worth relating here  ---

 

In the 1980's I was enchanted with the introduction of 1-Hour Photo machines.

I bought the equipment, which cost a small fortune.

The whole venture was influenced by the volume of film rolls that would come into the store.

 

When I had nearly paid-off the bank (5 years) the manufacturer came along and offered the "latest & greatest" upgrade machines --

Faster, better quality, enlargements, and monitor-screen previews of the film negatives.

 

I declined, and kept using my old "clunker"

 

At some point, of course, the entire consumer 35mm (and 110 Instamatic) market completely vanished, and 1-HOUR DEVELOPING became all but obsolete.

 

[sleeveofwizzard 104]

Can we all stand in a huddle and cry now? It chaps my hide that two of my closest competitors are set up to print and do every other service you could imagine. Trying to be competitive with that by mail with a subcontractor (Dakota) is difficult but just the fact that they can choose whatever color the customer wants and press print seems priceless to me. It never fails that I run out of or don't have the color the customer wants in stock. Whenever I think, "great, I can make a quick $100 profit on this $130 window job" then they tell you "I need it in three colors that you don't  have in stock right now." Now I go and buy $140 in vinyl and end up with $10 less then when I started today LOL! I know I have more inventory now and I charge extra if it's a color I don't normally stock but man, it just always seems to work out that way. The idea of only needing white vinyl to print on seems amazing to me! 

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Ted, if we can't buy a printer maybe we can chip in and buy an easy button.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

Ted it is cool and exciting but does that translate into being worth the expense, don't get me wrong I love my roland printer but it isn't as simple and cheap as a cutter and ordering colored vinyl - the problem recently was a drop out on several nozzles on the same black head I have had to replace twice in less than a year - and not it has been a year again.  I got it cleared up and printing perfectly again but at $950 a year for that same head along with all the other expenses I am just debating the whole "is it worth the expense" thing over the time it is useful.  when you have banding it is not a sellable product but I know many people run thier printers with nozzles mis firing.  to put out top quality product it isn't just hit print when you want something and forget it until you need the next thing . . . I am personally amazed at how many people run with poor nozzle checks and find it acceptable to have the grainy, overspray  or banded output - because they don't have the funds to keep the machine in the condition it should be in for the best output.  I know several on here that do take the time and spend the money for the upkeep or have bought new so for a short time have the warranty to fall back on but again the expense to do so it very very large.  like I have said time and time again it isn't the initial expense that will kill most budgets . .  .  with the fallen profit margin on printing it has gotten harder and harder to make it worth it.  someone with an older machine, marginally maintained with aftermarket inks will charge far less than someone with a top of the line running factory ink for the best longevity and color.  it would be an easy decision if it was just buy it and forget it like a desktop printer.  let one of these sit for a time unplugged or unused and watch the dollars add up.  I personally am doing better as I am running it daily now but would it still make sense to do it again . . . . 

[jaybyrd 3,770]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130962274815?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D130962274815%26_rdc%3D1

 I believe this is what is going to drive the print market to rock bottom.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Trust me I've been tempted to pull the trigger because i know I can dump it on craigslist if I had to and get most if not all of my money back.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130962274815?ru=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fsch%2Fi.html%3F_from%3DR40%26_sacat%3D0%26_nkw%3D130962274815%26_rdc%3D1

 I believe this is what is going to drive the print market to rock bottom.

we have seen those for a year - direct from china - using a recognizable brand that is popular in the US but not affiliated with them.  what is the parts supply and longevity - what is the quality of the prints.  I would bet the head is the same used on quality machines but what about the rest of the system?

 

where do you get the correct color profiles for whatever ink you run in it 

they sell artcut software and old encad carts - real confidence builder right there

[jaybyrd 3,770]

That is the real question and the only way to know is to pony up and be a guinea pig. The seller has 100% positive feedback but that doesn't say about longevity or parts. Their other pigment printer is based on the Novajet 750. My guess is most parts are readily available but the quality can only be known by purchasing and I'm too chicken to gamble that much money.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

I had a couple of encads early on - not thanks if that is what they are basing their design on.  check out their feedback - show sales and not one of that printer sold that I found searching 7 pages that goes back to 2012

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Now you're making me do detective work and all I see going back to first of this year is 3 of the pigment printers but this could be like I said about a lot of money to gamble on. I'm sure I'm not the only person looking but scared to lay down 5 grand on an unknown item. Looks like ebay buyer protection would cover if lot as described but would probably tie up your money fot at least several weeks trying to straighten it out.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

Like you said those pigment printers are based on copying the encad . . . The original encad was nothing to write home about. On the buyer protection once anything is confirmed delivered it is hard to do anything. . . We delivered you a printer, we never promised it was an acceptable print. Just had to get a new heating element for Stacey's Chinese cotton candy machine . . . What a nightmare and then had to modify the one we got as it didnt go on the shaft far enough

[jaybyrd 3,770]

I'm not confident enough to lay out the cash for sure but it does say that companies are trying to crack the market with low end machines kind of like when the chinese cutter invasion happened. They may not be the best but many will try them and end up saturating the market worse than it already is albeit with likely lower quality finished product.

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

I agree jay, and there are many people to lay out 4-5grand to have a printer no matter what the quality. It will be like the refine mh series cutters . . . Sell a bunch ant that wii fuel an upgrade to something much more capable like the graphtec. And for several they will just give up after realizing what it will really take. Again when they start trying to use a machine with a poor RIP they will not get far

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Hoping to win the lottery and retire before we all end up working for peanuts. 

[Dakotagrafx 7,297]

Jay did you notice the description of Smart appearance, High manufacture craft for all components and the imported rails for the head carriage LOL imported from where

[jaybyrd 3,770]

Imported from Taiwan. You know that's where all the good stuff comes from.  Smart appearance, High manufacture craft for all components is a fancy way of saying shiny. I like shiny. BTW I cracked up when I found it was imported from Taiwan, couldn't make that stuff up.

[jaybyrd 3,770]

I'm not gonna lie, if I were in a position to gamble I would give it a go. Hell I have 4 presses from China and 1/2 of my cutters are from China.