Seaside Embroidery 0 Posted June 11, 2018 I'm doing some shirts, Tumblers, and water bottles for a new coffee shop. I've Never did anything like this, and I need help. The design is super busy! It is 9 colors. I've tried just making it all one color, but is still alot of weeding. I tried a ink jet htv, but it looked terrible. Also I was wondering if anyone knew of a good printable waterproof vinyl to use for the tumblers? Also the shirts that I'm doing are black! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 11, 2018 sublimation printing is the way to go on stuff for the coffee shop - will require special printer, special mugs and tumblers and a mug press or cactus wraps. personally I wouldn't plan on printed vinyl or even cut vinyl holding up in that kind of use but if printed either latex or eco solvent printed 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 12, 2018 I have never heard of standard ink, inkjet htv. All the printable vinyl I am aware of uses solvent or eco-solvent ink. Those machines run 9k-200k. There are transfers for standard desktop inkjets. but are not vinyl. They are not great I find. Mileage varies. The cheapest entry into full color that still looks good is what Dakotagrafx said, sublimation. It just works on polyester. I would just get a dedicated sublimation printer if I did this, and not try to run sub inks through my daily printer. Maybe look into ordering plastisol transfers for the shirts such as https://www.fmexpressions.com/landing/full-color-program/ among many. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wildgoose 4,200 Posted June 12, 2018 +1 for F&M. Whether single color or multi they can be a good option for busy designs on shirts if you have the volume. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 12, 2018 20 hours ago, Seaside Embroidery said: I'm doing some shirts, Tumblers, and water bottles for a new coffee shop. I've Never did anything like this, and I need help. The design is super busy! It is 9 colors. I've tried just making it all one color, but is still alot of weeding. I tried a ink jet htv, but it looked terrible. Also I was wondering if anyone knew of a good printable waterproof vinyl to use for the tumblers? Also the shirts that I'm doing are black! 7 hours ago, Wildgoose said: +1 for F&M. Whether single color or multi they can be a good option for busy designs on shirts if you have the volume. HTV on tableware?? 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wildgoose 4,200 Posted June 12, 2018 No comment for the tableware just a plus one for the shirt option. didn't mean to confuse the subject. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
julian keller 20 Posted June 12, 2018 11 hours ago, dcbevins said: I have never heard of standard ink, inkjet htv. All the printable vinyl I am aware of uses solvent or eco-solvent ink. Those machines run 9k-200k. There are transfers for standard desktop inkjets. but are not vinyl. They are not great I find. Mileage varies. The cheapest entry into full color that still looks good is what Dakotagrafx said, sublimation. It just works on polyester. I would just get a dedicated sublimation printer if I did this, and not try to run sub inks through my daily printer. Maybe look into ordering plastisol transfers for the shirts such as https://www.fmexpressions.com/landing/full-color-program/ among many. Yea they make it. Some is decent but some is really really bad. I have some that I am going to be testing soon. They also have some for color laser printers too. Not sure how good that is but going to test it out when I get the chance. On another note, for a coffee shop where the mugs and such are going to subject to high heat and repeated abuse every day, you should only do Sublimation. Some of the commercial dishwashers go up to 180 fahrenheit with a sustained temp of 150. Then you have to figure that they will be using a detergent. No way any vinyl I know of will stand up to even one wash like that. Also you might want to check and see if you can sub it out and still make $$$. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 12, 2018 42 minutes ago, julian keller said: Yea they make it. Some is decent but some is really really bad. I have some that I am going to be testing soon. They also have some for color laser printers too. Not sure how good that is but going to test it out when I get the chance. Share a link to some of this stuff. I would love to see it and see how they got around some common problems. Aqueous ink on vinyl has a hard time drying. It will just slide off uncoated vinyl. Solvent inks I think of as almost acid like. They burrow into the substrate. Eco-solvent also, but less aggressively. So please link. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 12, 2018 10 minutes ago, dcbevins said: Share a link to some of this stuff. I would love to see it and see how they got around some common problems. Aqueous ink on vinyl has a hard time drying. It will just slide off uncoated vinyl. Solvent inks I think of as almost acid like. They burrow into the substrate. Eco-solvent also, but less aggressively. So please link. Here is a link to the vinyl (about 3 brands I have seen) https://www.uscutter.com/GreenStar-Aqueous-Adhesive-Backed-White-Matte-Vinyl-3mil Mr.300's showed me some before he passed away he played with and the problem was the vinyl is coated with a layer to allow the water based ink to adhere - what he showed me was after a year even laminated that coating is what failed and caused the release from the backing in spots - definitely not as durable as ecol solvent ink or latex that grips the vinyl. it really should not be used for selling decals except for short term - otherwise I feel it is taking advantage of the customer 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 12, 2018 7 minutes ago, Dakotagrafx said: Here is a link to the vinyl (about 3 brands I have seen) https://www.uscutter.com/GreenStar-Aqueous-Adhesive-Backed-White-Matte-Vinyl-3mil Mr.300's showed me some before he passed away he played with and the problem was the vinyl is coated with a layer to allow the water based ink to adhere - what he showed me was after a year even laminated that coating is what failed and caused the release from the backing in spots - definitely not as durable as ecol solvent ink or latex that grips the vinyl. it really should not be used for selling decals except for short term - otherwise I feel it is taking advantage of the customer Ah I was aware of this kind of adhesive vinyl, https://www.papilio.com makes some I've used, (for short term stuff,) before. 22 hours ago, Seaside Embroidery said: I tried a ink jet htv, but it looked terrible. It was "ink jet htv" that threw me. 1 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 12, 2018 for inkjet printable htv I have used JPSS and 3g opaque in the past with pretty good results before buying the eco solvent printer - may do it again after I sell the printer 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 12, 2018 13 minutes ago, Dakotagrafx said: for inkjet printable htv I have used JPSS and 3g opaque in the past with pretty good results before buying the eco solvent printer - may do it again after I sell the printer JPSS and 3g opaque are transfer papers not Heat Transfer Vinyl, (htv.) Maybe I am nit picking terms. I think of stuff like https://www.rolanddga.com/products/media/specialty/esm-htm3-heat-transfer-material when one says printable HTV. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 12, 2018 2 hours ago, dcbevins said: JPSS and 3g opaque are transfer papers not Heat Transfer Vinyl, (htv.) Maybe I am nit picking terms. I think of stuff like https://www.rolanddga.com/products/media/specialty/esm-htm3-heat-transfer-material when one says printable HTV. You are absolutely correct dcbevins, in the middle of new windows and Home Depot can’t measure. And they are one short on custom window with siding due next week. This is just one that is 2.5 “ off after they moved it up 3/4” I’ve been a little distracted, ok and they had vehicle problems so getting our bedroom windows in so we can move the bed back is on hold, Sorry to get off topic 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
julian keller 20 Posted June 13, 2018 On 6/12/2018 at 10:29 AM, dcbevins said: JPSS and 3g opaque are transfer papers not Heat Transfer Vinyl, (htv.) Maybe I am nit picking terms. I think of stuff like https://www.rolanddga.com/products/media/specialty/esm-htm3-heat-transfer-material when one says printable HTV. Yea I cannot find it now but it was HTV. Maybe that is the reason i cannot find it now. I did read a few posts that are up that it was causing issues in laser printers and melting to the drum...That was my first thought when i saw it. Even the inkjet one that I had bookmarked is not coming up. Oh well. There is plenty of transfer paper though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eprcvinyls 62 Posted June 15, 2018 A local Vinyl shop just posted today that they now have in stock Inkjet printable HTV selling it in sheets of 8 1/4 x 11 $2.25-2.99 depending if you want light or dark.. I never heard of this before I thought to be able to print your own you needed a 8K printer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 15, 2018 13 minutes ago, eprcvinyls said: A local Vinyl shop just posted today that they now have in stock Inkjet printable HTV selling it in sheets of 8 1/4 x 11 $2.25-2.99 depending if you want light or dark.. I never heard of this before I thought to be able to print your own you needed a 8K printer Betting they have injet printable transfer sheets and not injet printable Heat Transfer Vinyl . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eprcvinyls 62 Posted June 16, 2018 7 hours ago, Dakotagrafx said: Betting they have injet printable transfer sheets and not injet printable Heat Transfer Vinyl . it says they now carry Printed HTV for inkjet printers. I even commented I didn't know they were such a thing for regular Inkjet printers and they said yes. unless im confused looks like uscutter sell it also https://www.uscutter.com/SISER-ColorPrint-Easy-Printable-Heat-Transfer-Vinyl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 16, 2018 I still don't think printable HTV, using standard desktop inks exists. Standard inkjet inks won't adhere to vinyl. It is vinyl. I don't know how you can make a vinyl that is but isn't vinyl. It's like making glue that isn't sticky. Printable HTV for eco-sovent inkjets has been around awhile. So yes, there is printalbe HTV for inkjets, with eco-solvent inks. I would love to be wrong. Show a link to anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted June 16, 2018 21 minutes ago, dcbevins said: I still don't think printable HTV, using standard desktop inks exists. Standard inkjet inks won't adhere to vinyl. It is vinyl. I don't know how you can make a vinyl that is but isn't vinyl. It's like making glue that isn't sticky.... Technical answer to that is, HTV is not Vinyl... It's Polyurethane. Here's a short article that calls out a few of the differences; http://hingstssignpost.blogspot.com/2013/04/the-differences-between-polyurethane.html And I also saw an ad for Inkjet Printable HTV a while back. I can't imagine it holding up but so well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted June 16, 2018 It does exist... Here are a few ads for "Inkjet Printable HTV"; https://www.uscutter.com/SISER-ColorPrint-Easy-Printable-Heat-Transfer-Vinyl?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=1o1&scid=scplp5522&sc_intid=5522&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiKDEm_zW2wIVA16GCh1J1ARHEAQYASABEgJv-vD_BwE https://www.brilliantvinyl.com/Inkjet-Printable-HTV-Transfers/ https://www.heattransferwarehouse.com/category/printable-heat-transfer-vinyl https://www.amazon.com/Printable-Transfer-Printer-Fabrics-T-shirts/dp/B07BS7556S Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 16, 2018 It is called HTV, not HTPU. But you are technically right. But I was using the common vernacular just because it is the common vernacular. Standard inkjet inks still don't stick or dry well to PU. 11 minutes ago, skarekrow said: It does exist... Here are a few ads for "Inkjet Printable HTV"; https://www.uscutter.com/SISER-ColorPrint-Easy-Printable-Heat-Transfer-Vinyl?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&adpos=1o1&scid=scplp5522&sc_intid=5522&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIiKDEm_zW2wIVA16GCh1J1ARHEAQYASABEgJv-vD_BwE https://www.brilliantvinyl.com/Inkjet-Printable-HTV-Transfers/ https://www.heattransferwarehouse.com/category/printable-heat-transfer-vinyl https://www.amazon.com/Printable-Transfer-Printer-Fabrics-T-shirts/dp/B07BS7556S The first link to Color Print: "ColorPrint Easy is the easiest weeding print and cut material ever! Compatible with eco-solvent and solvent based printers/cutters" Not standard inks. The second link to brilliant vinyl: "A heat press is highly recommended for applying this inkjet transfer paper due to temperature and pressure requirements. " Says it is a paper, not vinyl or PU since we are getting technical. The third link is more Color Print, sames as first. Forth link: First customer review I saw: "This product flaked off of the printed sheet. Please note several issues:1) The description says it is for inkjet printers. I used a regular inkjet printer. There are special inkjet printers that use Oil-Based & Eco-Solvent Ink. If this is a product for these special printers than it should have said so. I'm also going to report that this product is mislabeled. Is it vinyl or paper? It is listed in the Transfer Paper category. At the time of this review the description clearly says it is "Vinyl". This product didn't say it was for sublimation printing therefore I assumed, and rightfully so, that it was for a regular inkjet printer.2) The product came with two different labels attached to the plastic protective bag, which were "A4 Dark Transfer Paper" and the other says "Printable Heat Transfer Vin(yl). Which product is it?3) This product came with no cardboard insert to keep it from being bent, which it was. I returned this with a cardboard insert. This mailing issue should be on Amazon as it says that it is Fulfilled by Amazon." Seems like a scam. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dcbevins 340 Posted June 16, 2018 Mispost, where do I delete? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted June 16, 2018 Sorry, admittedly, I just scanned the Headings. I have to agree with you though Bevins... from what I know about desktop inkjet inks and PU and PolyVinyls, doesn't seem likely that the inks would adhere well or for very long. Seems like they haven't even really perfected the ecosolvent vinyl printing from the amount of it I see fading and peeling. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,298 Posted June 16, 2018 11 minutes ago, skarekrow said: Sorry, admittedly, I just scanned the Headings. I have to agree with you though Bevins... from what I know about desktop inkjet inks and PU and PolyVinyls, doesn't seem likely that the inks would adhere well or for very long. Seems like they haven't even really perfected the ecosolvent vinyl printing from the amount of it I see fading and peeling. I have seen a lot of fading on solvents with aftermarket inks but my personal experience is roland factory ink 4 years outside unlaminated looks just like when I installed it - on my last truck had several . . . newer truck I haven't stickered up. to me it is not worth saving maybe $10 ca cart for aftermarket inks and a lot more problems with my first printer that came with aftermarket inks - no problems once I converted it back to roland inks. looking at prints in new orlands a few years ago I think they was using some formula they cooked up in a bathtub - it was hideous on most places 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted June 16, 2018 I'm with you there, Dakota. I stick to OEM inks in my Epsons as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
