What kind of machine does this?

[youdude 1]

I know it is probably out of my price range but I was curious to know what type of machine it takes to make these window graphics/tint

[dgreenh 9]

Large format solvent printer.  $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[youdude 1]

yeah thats what I figured....but one can dream right?

[dgreenh 9]

I keep hoping US Cutter will find a Chinese model that is affordable and works good. 

[Jerry Bonham 1]

Solvent Printers.

yes, they will be coming however the cheapest solvent printer at the moment is about US$15,000.00

It is the price of the heads that is the killer.

6 heads at about US$1,500.00 each.

When the price of heads drops then we should see solvent printers at much lower prices.

What sort of printer am i discussing?

Specs

1390mm or 55 inches (if the printer was narrower it does not change the price as all the same bits are needed before someone asks me that)

6 heads (6 colors)

10 sq metres per hour printing speed (about 100 sq feet per hour)

True photo quality.  (tech stuff 12 picolitre drop size at native 720 dpi)

This is what we want and need to do this sort of work.

While the manufacturers can still get high prices for heads we will not see the price of printer drop.

However as all sales booms fade then the prices drop and printers will be affordable.

Jerry from SignBlazer.

[dgreenh 9]

Thank you for the words of encouragement Jerry... well, sort of encouraging words.  I can't afford one now anyway, by the time I can afford one, maybe the price will drop.  :yes:

[Jerry Bonham 1]

Just out of curiosity how much would you pay?

[dgreenh 9]

The question is how much would my wife let me pay. 

I've was tracking the used market for a while, they get somewhat reasonable in price but you never know how they were maintained and/or abused.  That would be a pretty expensive boat anchor if you bought the wrong one.  I'm guessing somewhere in the $5k to $6k range.  I would be happy with a 36" and not really interested in anything over 48".  I've seen a few new Chinese models for less than $4k using old head technology.

[Jerry Bonham 1]

I think that the next huge drop will be to about the 10K mark.

It will be another generation of heads before new solvent printers get a low as 5K to 6K.

This next generation of heads will have a native DPI of 1,600.

The manufacturer advises that these heads will be be put into a printer and the printer will have a retail price around the 6K mark.

However -- always a but -- it will be a few more years before we see them as right now they cannot supply the photo market with enough heads. 

If anyone asks my advice do not buy old or new Chinese printers with Xaar heads.

They are totally unsuitable for home or small business use.

It costs the same to make a 36 inch printer as it does a 55 inch printer.

Jerry from SignBlazer.

[dgreenh 9]

It won't be too long before competition in the print market drives the prices of hardware down.  The price for the printed product will drop below an acceptable margin and there will be a glut of good used machines on the market forcing the manufacturers to lower their prices considerably.  Just my thoughts.  The price per printed square foot keeps getting lower and lower.  That is going to drive a lot of people out of the business. 

I really just want one to play with.

[Jerry Bonham 1]

Actually you have made an excellent points here.

I never really think about the second hand market.

However this did not happen with vinyl cutters.

Demand drove the price down.

And i have yet to see a glut of second hand solvent printers unless they are old ones that cost more than they are worth to keep going.

Jerry from SignBlazer.

[dgreenh 9]

I recently bought a 8' x 2' full color, full bleed banner for $34.  So it is already getting close to $2 a square foot retail price.  It takes a lot of printing to pay off a printer at that price.  It is actually probably cheaper to outsource the printing than to own a printer unless your are doing a huge volume of work.

One of the reasons there isn't a glut of used vinyl cutters is because they are already cheap and plentiful.  I would let my cutter sit in the garage rather than go through the hassle of selling it.  But if I had a $16k printer that I wasn't using believe me, I would be trying to get rid of it. 

I actually have a 36" HP750P in my garage that is just gathering dust.  It just isn't worth selling.

[laserman70 2]

I recently bought a 8' x 2' full color, full bleed banner for $34.  So it is already getting close to $2 a square foot retail price.  It takes a lot of printing to pay off a printer at that price.  It is actually probably cheaper to outsource the printing than to own a printer unless your are doing a huge volume of work.

One of the reasons there isn't a glut of used vinyl cutters is because they are already cheap and plentiful.  I would let my cutter sit in the garage rather than go through the hassle of selling it.  But if I had a $16k printer that I wasn't using believe me, I would be trying to get rid of it. 

I actually have a 36" HP750P in my garage that is just gathering dust.  It just isn't worth selling.

Thats an amazing price.  I do warranty work for HP, how can it be worth buying a machine for 16,000  if you only charge that amount of money.  The supplies alone are so expensive, let alone the material and time you have involved.  The price needs to come down big time for me to purchase a machine to only make $34 on something that size.  If that is what the competition is charging out there, that is one part of the industry i am not interested in getting into....

[Guest Terry]

I have Encads that do it but there junk I think. I used a Roland that does it, 24" sixteen thousand dollars.

[Jay2703 704]

There was an Encad 700 on EBay last week. It sold for $99 + $475 shipping. I had my eye on it but didn't know enough about them to tell if it was any good. Came with loads of extra parts too.

[Jerry Bonham 1]

An Encad 700 is a waterbased printer.

It is totally useless for outdoor work and even indoor posters fade after a year or so.

Jerry from SignBlazer.

[Guest Terry]

Well not so in a way, depends on the Encad, some are thermal heat set, and it depends on if you use indoor or outdoor ink water base or dye, GX, GO, GO+ and you also need the outdoor mate vinyl. If its indoor vinyl or ink it would need to be laminated.

Encad, Inc., a Kodak Company, is a leading innovator in digital image printing technology. Offering a broad line of large format color inkjet printers and a complete selection of system tested indoor and outdoor inks and media, Encad's products deliver brilliant color images quickly and cost-effectively.

From the web site:

But its still a pile of junk in my opinion. I did it for a living at my job untill they bought a Roland for 16000

[dgreenh 9]

I believe some of the Chinese solvent printers us Encad heads.  Not saying that is good or bad, just saying...

[Jerry Bonham 1]

An Encad 700 is a waterbased dye ink printer.

Totally unsuitable for outdoor work.

Jerry from SignBlazer

[Guest Terry]

http://forum.uscutter.com/index.php?topic=1932.0

Bob NY post

[Guest Terry]

http://www.wide-format-printers.org/archival_inks_pigmented_inks/pigmented_archival_inks.html

[Guest Terry]

http://www.encad.com/Inks/Graphic-Outdoor/index.asp

Guarantee

Four-Year Performance Guarantee

Create the most durable, UV-resistant images in the industry. Pigment-based GO Inks are continually tested to ensure optimum image quality and reliability with all Encad printers including the NovaJet 800 Series. The results are incredible: long-lasting, photo-realistic images for outdoor use even without lamination. When used with recommended Kodak outdoor media, GO Inks provide you with guaranteed solutions up to 48 months.

Best Performance Guarantees in the Industry*

Print with confidence by using GO Matched System Inks and Media. When your business depends on the lasting quality of outdoor materials, you don

[Jerry Bonham 1]

An Encad 700 is a waterbased dye ink printer.

This is useless for outdoor work of any kind.

In full sun i have seen dye inks fade in 3 hours.

For the human eye to detect the slightest bit of fading there has to be a 20% loss of color.

Yep, that is right. 20%.

This number has been validated by scientists using photospectrometers. Whew i spelled it correctly first go!

Jerry from SignBlazer.

[Guest Terry]

  I bet your ready to just strangle me are you not. All in fun. It is a pile of junk or I would have kept it. Now don't be mad. 

[Beardown 0]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Roland-FJ-50-Wide-Format-Color-Printer-HiFi-Jet-Plotter_W0QQitemZ130186059272QQihZ003QQcategoryZ46724QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

So this would do that then correct?

Scroll to the bottom and it says its specs