TaterNuts 3 Posted May 27, 2009 Im thinking about making the plunge.... I have been cutting vinyl for years... In the past, I have cut vinyl stickers and decals and sold them at car shows/flea markets/trade centers.... I got a booth in a local trade center years ago, however, It was only open on friday saturday and sunday... I was working full time as well working afternoons, so i couldnt be at the booth all day long... I would go in when they opened around 10 and stayed tille about three when it was time to goto work... I made a decent amount of money... more over, re-invested in the business... Well long story short, the guy that ran the trade center ended up running it into the ground... The business closed after about a year or so... A new trade center opened up later down the road and we got a booth in there also, business was okay, however, it was alot of junk in the place. It was a dark building with only about half the lights working, dirty dilapated looking, however, we were still in business doing signs shirts stickers for car lots, bars, baseball teams ets.... Well, the building ended up being condemed due to leaky roof and no heat in the building... So once again, back home... I ran into other problems and stuff along the way, loosing my job I was at for almost ten years, moving, kids, etc.... I put cutting vinyl on the back burner... I have recently got on my feet again... and the trade center is opening up again (up to code now)... So i was thinking about going back, but i feel the hours they are open, (fri sat and sun) and with me working full time it is really holding me back... So the rent for the booth with electric and all that i need is 330 per month... However, I have found a 1500 sq foot building with garage for $450 per month.... So I am at a dilema on what to do.... The pros to my own building would be open when i want to be open, I can tailor my hours to work around my schedule at work.... I can set up the atmosphere that I want, not dirty looking like the trade center... However, the overhead would be alot more... I was always one of the cheapest in town due to the low overhead, however, the hours were killing me, I was only at my booth about 12-15 hours per week... My current set up right now is 3 cutters, 2 computers, heat press... small inventory of vinyl, some thermoflex, a few shirts, some banner material, coroplast, and about 10 tables.... the location of the building is between 2 major roads, however, not much traffic on the road that I am on.., but it wouldnt be difficult to find with advertisment.... I have a very minimum amount to invest in the business at this time... If i get the building, I will only have a few hundred to invest in materials after i pay rent, deposit, etc.... Should I go for the building, or the trade center.... Any advice, especially from people that already have sign shops (stores) will be appreciated... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
midwaste 4 Posted May 27, 2009 I'll say first that I don't have a sign shop, but I have been mulling over the same thing as you for some time now. Obviously, you would be paying much less per sqft at your own shop vs the trade center/flea market. I was looking at a similar space with 1500sqft (for about 1K a month) and started looking into how in the hell I would furnish it. Like you said, you have the freedom to create the environment you want, which is exciting. Until you start looking at what it would cost to furnish it. I found some racks, gondolas, etc on CL for a very reasonable price, but still, it takes quite a few racks to fill 1500 sqft, or even 750. Keep this in mind, as well as any upgrades you would want, paint, lighting, exterior signage, FLOORING. It adds up quick. I estimated that I wouldn't even begin trying to kick off a business in a space that size with less than $7-8K. It could be done for less, but you will have to make tough decisions on where to cut corners. The other thing to think about is what are you going to do with all that space? I would venture to say that most all of us make do with our home space around 250-500sqft. You are going to have to find something to fill all that space, otherwise it will look empty, and worse than the flea market. One option I explored was renting out booth space to crafters, which is something to think about. "The pros to my own building would be open when i want to be open, I can tailor my hours to work around my schedule at work" Not really, as your business will suffer if you have odd or inconsistent hours. No one likes going to a business to find that they open at a different time every day of the week, and that will give your competitors an edge. Advertisement. With the flea market, you are going to get whatever advertising they do, as well as the ancillary traffic from the adverts of your neighbors, which is obviously one of the biggest draws of such a setup. Sorry for the rambling, long story short, I decided to hold off for now. If I had a local flea market that was even close to some of them I have seen in neighboring states, I would kick that off and build some capital and steady business until I jumped into a shop, but that's just my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TaterNuts 3 Posted May 27, 2009 Thanks Midwaste for your advice.... I didnt really consider how I would make the shop look full... I do have someone that wants to go into the business with me and split expenses 50/50... She does custom apparel for the handicapped as in clothing for amputees and weighted blankets and vests for autism children. I have considered the schedule, I work the same schedule consistently at work which is 4-midnight, so I was thinking about making the hours 9-3 or so including weekends, i havent determined which day to be closed... That doesnt mean that I still cannot work in the building when closed if I have a large banner or shirt order or something... The best thing About this building is there is a main floor area and 2 seperate rooms, I would obviously utilize one room for my equipment/inventory and the main floor area for my displays as in t-shirts, signs, my portfolio, etc... I am currently living in a 3 bed room mobile home right now... As it is big enough for my old lady, our 2 kids and myself, I find myself having to lug out my equipment when trying to make anything as I utilize my kitchen table mostly for my work... When I am done, I have to put everything away, as this is a terrible inconvience... The 1500 sq feet includes the garage which is somewhat long and big.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Schramm Posted May 27, 2009 Tater, If you have done your homework and feel good about this then take the plunge. I have a building downtown but have never used it. It is 1200 sf and cost me $300 per month but sits there empty as I have not decided what I want to put in there. I too have thought about opening a shop that offers RTA vinyl. I like the idea of RTA as that way I will only be cutting and weeding and not doing the application (not that I mind the application). I think your ready, have the experinece and should go for it! Let us know what you do and good luck! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TaterNuts 3 Posted May 27, 2009 Thanks Guys... I do feel good about this... However, Im concerned about getting stuck into a lease, and that my business will not support my expenses.... Im not going to be quitting my full time job right away as I use that to pay my bills now... So I understand that it is going to take awhile to turn a profit... Im willing to wait for that... I just want to make enough to cover my expenses for now.... Due to the location of the shop, I will have to do alot of advertising... But that is probably why it is so cheap as it is not in a High traffic area... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BannerJohn 1,324 Posted May 27, 2009 If you wait until things are 'just right' or until you are 100% sure of success, you will still be working on the kitchen table when you are old and grey. Taking chances is what makes things happen. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fivestar Posted May 27, 2009 If there's no traffic on the road the building is on it is going to be hard to get people there. There's a reason they say "location, location, location". I myself would probably look into the trade center, it may be $330.00/month but everything is paid there, utilities, overhead, etc. Start there and build your client base up. Be sure to have business cards and pass them out like crazy, let people know when they are at your booth that you're "in the process" of trying to acquire a retail location. That's what I would do anyways. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cre8tiveCutter 7 Posted May 27, 2009 Tater, My advise for what its worth is to tell you to go for it especially if you have someone willing to split the costs 50/50. Would be great for you if you have somewhere you can set up all your equipment and not have to put it all away everytime! you can leave projects in progress spread out all over and not worry about it. Seems like a great deal to me! I opened my shop last year and havent looked back. I'm on a side street off the main street, I have put every cent back in my shop with improvements and more shirts, vinyl etc etc. unless you have a big fat checking account you will have to start small. I have alot of empty shelf space and I will slowly fill it up with mail boxes I want to decorate as well as etched glass items etc, when I have time! I have done flyers and I hope to have some kind of event this summer, I have been thinking about what I want to do, some kind of customer appreciation day thing, hot dogs and hamburgers etc my parking lot is big enough to set something up. Keep in mind that everything you do and buy is a tax break for you. Keep every receipt you get. There are so many advantages to having your own place versus a flea market setting. I also participate in the town summertime craft shows etc. We have many of those. There are so many cheap ways to advertise and get your name out there! Let us know what you decide and Best of luck to you! Renee Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fivestar Posted May 27, 2009 If you wait until things are 'just right' or until you are 100% sure of success, you will still be working on the kitchen table when you are old and grey. Taking chances is what makes things happen. John I am trying to convince myself of that for a wide format printer. I just can't justify the huge cost of it yet. Now back to topic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
midwaste 4 Posted May 27, 2009 Thats a cool looking little place there. I misunderstood about the sq footage, it looks like you have maybe 500 sq ft or less of "showroom" that you would have to furnish, and it looks pretty close. Just need some shelves and a few racks. Might want to find out what the utilities are in the summer and winter keeping the place warm and cool.. Don't forget to budget in some signage on the biggest main road close by. Maybe work out a trade with another business on a corner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BannerJohn 1,324 Posted May 27, 2009 I operated an upholstery shop on a road that wasn't even CLOSE to a major road or highway..yet people found me. Don't let that stop you. I stayed busy in that loaction for 14 years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragan 3 Posted June 29, 2009 Same boat lost job have house kids dog and bills I do air brushing and just bought a copam 48" never even seen a cutter used untill I used mine this week. No one to help me except what I read on here and the net. Well the way I look at It is I have nothing to lose and I will not be 60 years old working in a crappy factory job because there is none in ont. Canada any more and looking back and wondering what could of happened back then with going on my own. I`m in a crappy spot just like you with no time and I`m going to take that chance so I`m not wondering what could of happened back then when I was 36. And if it does not work I`m still in the hard spot i`m in now but at least I know and I tried. Your own shop vs 3 days a week and a full time job. not much time left for family and your self. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buggie Pilot 4 Posted June 30, 2009 Possibilities, Possibilities, Possibilities, I'd take the new shop, try to find an old shopmate at the trade center to do some cross advertising (trade for goods) to get traffic to your new location. I wish I had an opportunity like that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kctrader 10 Posted June 30, 2009 It's been a month since the original post. Did you make a decision? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gooddeal 0 Posted July 7, 2009 You need to take a wider view. If the building has sat empty , you should do a lease with option to buy. Your current income tax on your salary is at least 28%. This will allow you to write the current expenses against you income. On sharing - sublease or hire as an independent subcontractor [ 1099 never W2 ]. As you grow you will build equity in the building ----- and there is your retirement income. As far as space my warehouse [ 3500 sqft ] filled up in 30 days. This is America and every thing is for sale / so sell every thing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
