George2014 6 Posted December 13, 2014 I want to purchase printer to print decals (on clear or white film) What would be best option in terms price/quality ratio. I tried my color laser and regular HP inkjet printer but quality is not the best. They both do 600 DPI. I can see pixels and colors are not great at all. Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 13, 2014 Roland with white option for the clear. Bn20 starts at $8500 plus you will need a laminator Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kylesmash 36 Posted December 13, 2014 I think the price scared him off. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pshawny 410 Posted December 13, 2014 Get a decent Epson inkjet and some papilio brand products. This will give you short-term outdoor use of 6-12 months. Not a pro setup, but it will get you started. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
George2014 6 Posted December 13, 2014 Yes, 8,500 is a bit steep for a toy Although, got to admit, printer is impressive. But if I am not going to be in printing sign business hard to justify purchase. I guess my option would be the Epson ( what I do is inside, covered with clear epoxy). Or may be outsource printing to local company with the printer. I had a successful test with my color laser printer and clear laser labels. I just did not like colors. Professional printing looks more vibrant.... So I was trying to figure out how to get those colors. Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jburns 239 Posted December 13, 2014 Hi George2014, Welcome to the forums. I beleive some guys on here run the Epson Wide format printers and CobraInk.com I am not an expert, but maybe you can run the inks necessary for what you would like to do. I am not sure if U/V resistance inks are available for this printer. I would run a search on WF7620, 7610 etc. But keep me posted- I would like to learn also! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 13, 2014 epson from cobra uses pigment - like mentioned above good for 6-12 months laminated. to print on clear you are not going to like the colors unless you can print the white ink as an undercoat - for the colors to reflect off. Where a lot of people get lost is uv resistant dye inks like hp uses and the uv cured ink like roland uses. the uv resistant ink just prolongs the normal 4 year lifespan of dye ink to a few more years but is in no way a long term solution. roland and some other companies have came out with uv cured ink - very expensive (more than solvent) but eco friendly. besides initial cost in the thousands from what I have read the very expensive uv curing lamps need replacing every couple of years - making them more expensive to run than solvent but again some contracts state to use them because they are not as toxic as solvent. the other two options are latex ink from ho (again many thousands) and thermo resin like the gerber printers use. any way you cut it true outdoor printing is not cheap and with the cheap mail order it is hard to justify them - even when replacing current equipment. personally I run about $1K a year in maint to keep my solvent top notch. this year was about 20 percent more but had to add new encoder strip, encoder reader, to the normal head, wipers, pads, scrapers, etc from normal wear and tear.best way to learn is at a trade show or a roland dealer near you Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
knucklehead 530 Posted December 13, 2014 Or, Gerber Edge with foils, makes a damn fine decal. Or, a Summa printer, cutter. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sue2 920 Posted December 13, 2014 I have an older HP5500 wide format inkjet printer and it will print very nicely on white vinyl...I don't know if there is clear available. BUT, as Scott says above, in order to get good color on a clear (or dark) substrate you have to lay down a white base.... which sort of defeats the purpose of the clear substrate. The attached photo below shows a sun/weather test I did several years ago. The sign was printed on white vinyl, mounted on coro. I laminated the top half with a UV laminate and the bottom no protection. It was outside for 3 years facing full sun. There was very little color fade in the laminated top. It was a good test. For your use, it depends on what the end product is and the exposure. Large decals or small labels? Simple rectangular designs or contour cut? How long do you expect the print to hold up? How many...5 or 6 decals or 1000s? For simple stuff you could probably get away with an older printer like I have and good vinyl substrate with a UV Laminate. For clear or contour cut without the extra laminate step, you will have to consider the more expensive equipment... Roland BN20, etc. Best of luck! Sue2 8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaybyrd 3,770 Posted December 13, 2014 The bottom half looks like some of the stuff I've seen from Vista Print after a couple months. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted December 13, 2014 ...and the top half seems pretty respectable, considering the equipment. (no offense intended, Sue. As a matter of fact, Kudos to you... well done!) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 13, 2014 true sue - looks good for that long - was that in full weather so it got the driving rains etc? how have they held up on cars etc with car washes over time? most of the ones I have seen the coating that allows the ink to adhere lifts in about a year even laminated - causing spots Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sue2 920 Posted December 13, 2014 true sue - looks good for that long - was that in full weather so it got the driving rains etc? how have they held up on cars etc with car washes over time? most of the ones I have seen the coating that allows the ink to adhere lifts in about a year even laminated - causing spots Yes, the sign was out in that flowerbed in front of the building for 3 years. I've had no complaints on the vehicle magnets....I do try and have the laminate overlap the vinyl just a bit to seal it on the edges. But I still have that coro sign and those edges aren't peeling. Maybe I just stumbled onto a good combination of vinyl & laminate. ...and the top half seems pretty respectable, considering the equipment. (no offense intended, Sue. As a matter of fact, Kudos to you... well done!) No offense taken.....Yeah....the printer is older but it works for what signage we offer....mostly small quantities & prints. Would I like something better? Of course, who wouldn't!! Lexjet has been tempting me with $1000 trade-in on a new HP I'm tempted but I have some ink & printhead supplies to use up. PLUS the learning curve issue with new equipment! Sue2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lablover 218 Posted December 13, 2014 Sue, that is regular inkjet on white vinyl? If so....WOW I gotta look into that! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sue2 920 Posted December 13, 2014 It's a wide format inkjet....probably 9 years old now. 6 ink cartridges. It will print up to 42" wide on roll paper....coated adhesive vinyl, photo gloss, banner vinyl.....and whatever. They take up a lot of real estate....but can do a lot too. Like I said...Lexjet is tempting me with a $1000 trade-in on a newer HP and that's about what it's worth now.... Sue2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
George2014 6 Posted December 13, 2014 Okay, it's getting a bit confusing here... I would tell exactly what i am trying to do. I sell body jewelry (belly rings, tongue rings, plugs) So i want to be able to make custom plugs Here is an example http://www.mspiercing.com/ProductImages/l/pair-black-acrylic-leaf-saddle-plugs-10967.jpg Here are the steps to get it done. 1. Print the Leaf (in this case on clear label paper). 2. Send it through cutter to cut out perfect circle. 3. Stick it to the base plug 4. Put a bit of resin (clear epoxy) on top if it. Epoxy levels itself, create a little dome (like any liquid would do on the surface) and makes that shine look. Since it's covered in resin 100%, picture does not need to be scratch resistant, weather proof, .... I had done test with my color laser printer (got a cutter from uscutter SC Laser II). All works well except pictures come out dull. So if someone let me know if i just need a better quality printer and model/make that would do i would appreciate it. Thanks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 13, 2014 Okay, it's getting a bit confusing here... I would tell exactly what i am trying to do. I sell body jewelry (belly rings, tongue rings, plugs) So i want to be able to make custom plugs Here is an example http://www.mspiercing.com/ProductImages/l/pair-black-acrylic-leaf-saddle-plugs-10967.jpg Here are the steps to get it done. 1. Print the Leaf (in this case on clear label paper). 2. Send it through cutter to cut out perfect circle. 3. Stick it to the base plug 4. Put a bit of resin (clear epoxy) on top if it. Epoxy levels itself, create a little dome (like any liquid would do on the surface) and makes that shine look. Since it's covered in resin 100%, picture does not need to be scratch resistant, weather proof, .... I had done test with my color laser printer (got a cutter from uscutter SC Laser II). All works well except pictures come out dull. So if someone let me know if i just need a better quality printer and model/make that would do i would appreciate it. Thanks. like stated above you need a white background to make the colors pop - that is why I suggested the printer with a white ink option so you can print the white base behind the color part. the inks are translucent and need the white base to look right. here is the same image on white and just printed on clear . . . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
knucklehead 530 Posted December 13, 2014 stouse.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
George2014 6 Posted December 13, 2014 Okay, Got it, inks are translucent. So the plug above (http://www.mspiercing.com/ProductImages/l/pair-black-acrylic-leaf-saddle-plugs-10967.jpg) How is it done? 1. First picture printed on clear label with white color 2. Print on top with "Real color" 3. Cut out ? Are those printers that precise that i will not see white color? In a picture you showed me, there is a pretty big white border around the log... thanks a lot for the help. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 13, 2014 first from your picture I don't see where it has to be printed on clear - print on white and trim and dome it - personally I bet those are done on a gerber thermo resin printer - with solvent you can have trouble with cutting into that dark area and having it curl as it shrinks as it outgases - the solvent actually gets into the vinyl. best bet with solvent would be to print and let it set and outgas a day or two then cut and dome. with the gerber there is no outgasing and you can even print on chrome vinyl. not sure on the price on them but I am thinking they are around $15K for a new one that prints 15" wide material . . . but you would have to do research on that one. if you are doming maybe the cheaper aqueous inks would work in this situation (if you print on white vinyl) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
George2014 6 Posted December 13, 2014 So i guess you saying: 1. Print an image on white with black circle around it. 2. Cut it out. I really do not think cutter can cut out those jagged leaves perfectly. Hence why i wanted clear. But putting a big black circle around it will work (i guess). thanks for the idea. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jaybyrd 3,770 Posted December 13, 2014 Why not print the black larger tan the finished item (bleed) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
knucklehead 530 Posted December 13, 2014 Gerber Edge $950.00 in Atlanta http://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/bfs/4790191844.html 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted December 14, 2014 Gerber Edge $950.00 in Atlanta http://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/bfs/4790191844.html man - if the heads are good that is a great deal Share this post Link to post Share on other sites