Transfer paper not working HELP

[Worble7 15]

Transfer Paper not lifting my vinyl  Transfer paper is MT80P and the vinyl is Oracal 651 any ideas what tape will really work on this vinyl??? Thanks Jeff 

[haumana 1,220]

Could be the tape is old, could be the cutter cut the vinyl, but didn't really cut the adhesive under the vinyl, could be you didn't squeegee it good, etc.

have you tried to peel the backing away (vs. peeling the tape up to release it)? you can also try squeegeeing the back of the paper too.

[Worble7 15]

haumana,

New cutting teflon strip new clean cut 60 deg. Blade with no cut marks on my vinyl backing. I can't say how old my vinyl is I just bought it and the transfer paper matter fact I now have tried 2 different kinds of transfer paper and they both dont pull up the vinyl. I have been squeegeeing the hell out of it with only some of it coming up. Any tips tricks would be greatly appreciated I'm at a lose on this and can't do anything with my vinyl. Thanks Jeff

[slice&dice 2,450]

In my experience, if the cuts are too deep into the backing paper, the vinyl decals get 'stuck' (sorta fused onto the backing layer).  However, you say this is not happening, so there's something else going on here.

 

[Wildgoose 4,200]

Oracal 651 is known to be a little problematic from time to time in this one regard. It seems to have a good hold on the carrier. The upside is that that hold is also what helps it weed good for a calendared vinyl. The best cure I have found is just before install run it over a sharp edged table app tape side down so that the sharp angle on the table or bench will help break the vinyl loose from the carrier. Then lay the vinyl face down on the app tape side and peel the backing up and away from the vinyl. I have best luck if I can get a slight roll action going on the carrier sheet and it will sort of snap or pop up off the vinyl. Not all rolls of 651 fight as bad as some others. 751 and 951 do not have this issue. 

I also like to use R-Tape 4076RLA. It is slightly higher tack than 4075. 

[ShaneGreen 131]

Keep in mind that the transfer tape should NOT "lift the vinyl."  The backing paper should be peeled away from the vinyl.  And be sure that you're pulling at a much larger than 90 degree angle...the backing paper that has released should almost be touching the backing paper that still needs to come off.  It makes a huge difference on some vinyls and colors. 

I've got some Oracal 5600 white reflective laying here and reflective is sort of two-ply.  The backing paper and adhesive are stuck to the bottom reflective layer and then the top layer is a semi-transparent colored vinyl.  If you try to "lift the vinyl" with the transfer tape you'll end up with spots where the reflective layer stays stuck to the backing paper.  At the price of reflective you'll learn that lesson real quick.

 

[Worble7 15]

Thank you slice&dice, Wildgoose, shaneGreen,

I will try that wildgoose

shanegreen I'm missing it on the reflective tape about How to remove it I do have some of it and it's expensive would not want to mess alot if that up.

Thanks for all the help everyone. Jeff

[ShaneGreen 131]

I was just using the reflective as an example.  It being constructed the way it is, it has a tendency to delaminate if you do it wrong, which makes it easy to see that you're doing something wrong. I learned the right way through a few very expensive lessons.

No matter what type of vinyl you are using, ALWAYS remove the backing paper from the vinyl & transfer tape.  Never try to "lift the vinyl" from the backing paper.  It may seem like two ways of saying the same thing, but it isn't.  Peeling the backing paper back over the top of itself and sliding it off is the correct way to do it.

Someone on here once gave a great description and I wish I could find it. Let me see if I can do it justice...

A. The adhesive on the vinyl has to be strong enough to permanently stick to the final surface (rear window, wall, bumper, mug, etc.).

B. The adhesive on the vinyl has to be week enough to release from the backing paper. To help this, the backing paper has a slightly waxy finish.  This bond is also designed to release when the angle of force is greater than 90 degrees, so pulling the backing paper back over the top of itself goes way past 90 degrees.  Simply put, you can't pull the two slices of bread apart on a grilled cheese sandwich because all of that gooey cheese across both surfaces is fighting against you.  But if you grab one  corner and peel it back you are only fighting the thin line where it's trying to separate.

C. The transfer tape adhesive must be weaker than the bond between the vinyl and the final surface (bond A). If not, then you'd never get the vinyl to release from the transfer tape.

D. The transfer tape adhesive must be stronger than the bond between the vinyl and the backing paper (bond B )

Logic says that the transfer tape can't be both weaker than and stronger than at the same time.  Two things allow this:

1) The substrates.  The adhesive has to stick better to the final surface than it does the backing paper, hence the waxy surface.

2) The removal force. Bonds A & C are almost always fighting forces applied to the vinyl at 90 degrees or less which is where they are the strongest.  Bonds B & D are broken at an angle greater than 90. . . by folding the backing paper back over itself and that's where the bond is weakest.  But if you try to break Bonds B & D by pulling up the transfer tape and vinyl you aren't passing 90% and you're fighting the strongest bond.