julian keller

Trying to get this all figured out

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So I just started my business.  Granted it is on the side and I have already done 3 smaller orders, one was for a person that owns a mid size business and this was for his Half marathon this weekend, he asked about me doing logos for his company if he provides the shirts.  Sounds great to me.

Now for the struggling part. I have been reading up on pricing, getting all my ducks in a row and paying the Government for all the licensing. I don't have a sign shop near me and the closest is 20+ miles away in bad traffic. No sooner as I start this up all these ads start popping up from people using Cricuts and silhouettes to do decals and shirts. There were none for the past 3 weeks, I checked to see what I would have as competition.   Michaels and Joanns had a sale and sure enough they started coming up.

They are going WAY cheap. Cheaper than I can from my calculations with all the fees, materials, and equipment that I bought to make a *profit* to start getting a ROI.  Has anyone came up on this type of flood from Stay At home Mom's and Dad's that want to start doing everything I am doing?  Granted they cannot do the larger stuff like I can but just starting out it looks like it will cut into my customer base. 

I am trying to market myself as a reliable business and stand out over them but with what they are charging it is tough. Kinda like the Made In USA vs China cheap.  They are doing 5x5 decals for $1-$2 on cheaper vinyl. I can't bring myself to use that stuff and sacrifice quality but people want cheap and most don't care if it lasts 6 months or less.

Quitting my job is not an option to do this full time as I am up for a promotion and will be a decent increase to my yearly income.

 

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I learned long ago not to price myself based solely on what my competition prices. Yes you need to know what's going on around you but if they all started handing out dollar bills would you also? Heck no. I mainly got my clients because the other guys couldn't or wouldn't turn product around quick enough. I work a full time type job myself and I was still beating the turn time of most of the others by like a week or two just working evenings and weekends. I think a lot of this was because the other guys were busy and I was just happy to get ANYTHING at that point so I jumped on it but at the end of the day those clients now come to me for all their work. I still try to be as quick as I can but as I get busy I have to do the same thing the others do and put them in a line. My best clients get my priority but if I have a huge order that will take two weeks I squeeze in a couple small ones during the process so they don't have to wait if it's something that I can bust out quickly. 

Find some specialty niche markets. Softball teams and things that have a lot of individual numbers and personalized names are a great money maker and they are always super pumped about having fan gear. I do the jerseys at a fair and reasonable price, probably too cheap but the fan gear is a real money maker. 

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You need to profit from the shirts, too.

If you owned a car mechanic garage, would you agree to just replacing parts that customers bring to you (they ordered cheaper from RockAuto online)?

 

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, slice&dice said:

You need to profit from the shirts, too.

If you owned a car mechanic garage, would you agree to just replacing parts that customers bring to you (they ordered cheaper from RockAuto online)?

 

 

 

 

Yes I would and have a labor charge plus shop supplies.  I would be turning away potential customers and profit if not. 

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No mechanics I've run across will do that. In fact, the markup on parts is a major element of what keeps their business alive.

 

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I offer the same price if I supply the shirt or they bring one - but with their shirt there is no guarantee - it pretty well takes care of the risk and the customers that I really don't want to deal with anyways - - -- if you worry about getting every customer you will certainly end up with the short straw most of the times - plan what your cost is with your labor including design time and stick with it.   We see so many people every year chasing the small dollar customer and they are gone in a year or so because it wasn't worth it

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1 hour ago, slice&dice said:

No mechanics I've run across will do that. In fact, the markup on parts is a major element of what keeps their business alive.

 

It is pretty common here that they will do it.  I even had it done a few times because I did not have the time to do it myself.

 

1 hour ago, Dakotagrafx said:

I offer the same price if I supply the shirt or they bring one - but with their shirt there is no guarantee - it pretty well takes care of the risk and the customers that I really don't want to deal with anyways - - -- if you worry about getting every customer you will certainly end up with the short straw most of the times - plan what your cost is with your labor including design time and stick with it.   We see so many people every year chasing the small dollar customer and they are gone in a year or so because it wasn't worth it

Yes, I agree about the risk and let them know beforehand.  I am taking the tips here and considering them.  I very well may change my thoughts. I don't have my stock of shirts at the moment so if they bring some then it is a quicker turnaround time is what my thought is. I see what you are saying though.

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Unless you have many hundreds of dollars laying around you want to tie up in inventory I don't stock much in the way of shirts. I keep some black and white and then I have a school nearby that tends to need navy so I keep a few of them. Most times I never have the right size in the right color. I just usually order after they pay me and I also bid in a couple extra in case I mess up. (You will) and if you don't mess up you get to keep it and throw it in your inventory and sell it (again <snicker>). 

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You sound just like me, I got my First Cutter on Valentines day of this year and before that I hardly seen anyone around Facebook groups doing this stuff, well it seem like the first week i get my stuff that now everyone is doing it, Every time i see a "Can someone make me this " there are already 20 replies with everyone either giving out there facebook page or tagging a friend or someone they know who has a small cutter and does logos.. I try to put out there that i use good , new well made vinyl that will last unlike others. If people want to get me to do there stuff great.... So far Honestly i've not made what i thought i would but its been only 2 months, So I guess honestly Ive not done bad. All of what i have done have been 95% decals. I just ordered me a 15x15 heat press and Going to try pushing more for t shirts. It is amazing how many people don't understand about Vinyl shirts one of my FB friends asked if they held up being wash. I let him know he probably has Vinyl made shirts at home and doesn't even realize it.

I have kinda become friends with a local Vinyl shops and they make all there money on T shirts. I hope I can make some. Right now i'm doing Family Reunion Shirts for my women's fathers side and i'm charging $15-25 depending on size. Not sure if others charge more for the shirts per size but I have to since i have no money up to just supply the shirts.

Good luck hope you figure out what works for you.. I been charging $8 for up to a 6x6 decal and prices go up after that size and or if more then one color..

 

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, eprcvinyls said:

You sound just like me, I got my First Cutter on Valentines day of this year and before that I hardly seen anyone around Facebook groups doing this stuff, well it seem like the first week i get my stuff that now everyone is doing it, Every time i see a "Can someone make me this " there are already 20 replies with everyone either giving out there facebook page or tagging a friend or someone they know who has a small cutter and does logos.. I try to put out there that i use good , new well made vinyl that will last unlike others. If people want to get me to do there stuff great.... So far Honestly i've not made what i thought i would but its been only 2 months, So I guess honestly Ive not done bad. All of what i have done have been 95% decals. I just ordered me a 15x15 heat press and Going to try pushing more for t shirts. It is amazing how many people don't understand about Vinyl shirts one of my FB friends asked if they held up being wash. I let him know he probably has Vinyl made shirts at home and doesn't even realize it.

I have kinda become friends with a local Vinyl shops and they make all there money on T shirts. I hope I can make some. Right now i'm doing Family Reunion Shirts for my women's fathers side and i'm charging $15-25 depending on size. Not sure if others charge more for the shirts per size but I have to since i have no money up to just supply the shirts.

Good luck hope you figure out what works for you.. I been charging $8 for up to a 6x6 decal and prices go up after that size and or if more then one color..

 

 

 

 

Shirts are a bigger market. Just look at your own life. How much of your budget goes to shirts vs vinyl decals? I'll be honest, I started mine out for fun and knowing that I may not make a red cent. I gave a LOT of stuff away to friends and family with no strings attached. I told them I needed the practice which was true. Word of mouth is the best advertising and you can't buy it. Half my clients at the very least came from that first 6 months of not worrying about whether it paid off or not. I also occasionally brought in promo gift shirts to other businesses that I frequent enough to know the manager/owners and showed them what I could do. 

Advice I would give the newbies. I used to try and explain the difference between screen print and HTV.  I figured telling people about the lifespan would sell the product and it does if they actually understand the difference. About 10% of the people understood. I quit trying to explain it and just do so if they actually ask me about it, meaning they WILL get it because they want to know. I do a fair amount of plastisol transfers so technically do both these days and promote them based almost strictly on volume. I used to do hundreds of HTV shirts and now I just don't have the time to spend cutting and weeding that kind of volume. It's more effective to spell out how one or the other is the best choice for a given application or volume. 

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2 hours ago, eprcvinyls said:

. I been charging $8 for up to a 6x6 decal and prices go up after that size and or if more then one color..

You guys sound like your all competing for those small decals.. Wouldn't you rather make  say $75-100 for a set of decals?  Think big. If your good,  You can make $100 an hour.  I only make those smaller decals out of left over vinyl. So that is pretty much Free, just labor.  I started with big decals right away,  And I don't care what others charge.  Big is my niche'.  Selling a couple to 5 a week of big sets, makes for a nice week  and less work. 

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7 hours ago, MZ SKEETER said:

You guys sound like your all competing for those small decals.. Wouldn't you rather make  say $75-100 for a set of decals?  Think big. If your good,  You can make $100 an hour.  I only make those smaller decals out of left over vinyl. So that is pretty much Free, just labor.  I started with big decals right away,  And I don't care what others charge.  Big is my niche'.  Selling a couple to 5 a week of big sets, makes for a nice week  and less work. 

Absolutely I would! What size starting would you say is big?

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1 hour ago, julian keller said:

Absolutely I would! What size starting would you say is big?

I make 20" w x 96"L clear up to 16ft L   sets.   16ft would be a custom order.  But I can do it.   I work by myself on one 8 ft long table.   Big decals are also easier to weed.  I also can tape them in 1 taping, not sections of mask.  Gotta have the right tools for the job. I love the Maskrite taper.. I have used it since I started.  Nothing clamped down to my table.  

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35 minutes ago, MZ SKEETER said:

I make 20" w x 96"L clear up to 16ft L   sets.   16ft would be a custom order.  But I can do it.   I work by myself on one 8 ft long table.   Big decals are also easier to weed.  I also can tape them in 1 taping, not sections of mask.  Gotta have the right tools for the job. I love the Maskrite taper.. I have used it since I started.  Nothing clamped down to my table.  

Well heck I can make one of those from the old rollers from the conveyor lines I got from work! The room though is a different story...lol!  I have all my metal working, wood working, and electronics bench in the garage so I don't have much room if any.

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7 minutes ago, julian keller said:

Well heck I can make one of those from the old rollers from the conveyor lines I got from work! The room though is a different story...lol!  I have all my metal working, wood working, and electronics bench in the garage so I don't have much room if any.

I work out of a bedroom in my house, and I  sell online only. 

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My workspace is our dining room table. It's a wonky shape (not rectangle) so not ideal but you learn workarounds as you do things. I have gravitated to mostly garments and they work fine on an oval table. :lol:

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I have not tried the mask right taper system and they probably work well. I bought the Big Squeegee Cut Vinyl tool and use it for taping off the work. Like anything it takes some learning but after getting used to it taping off long, sometimes WAY LONG cuts are a snap. I have done things in the 14 to 22 foot range. The trick is getting lined up straight so you don't run off the side on your way to the far end. I don't do much cut vinyl anymore but do an occasional big job here and there and as Skeeter mentioned there is easy money in that market. Well, easy if you are good and have a quality cutter. Budget cutters don't track very good and can make a mess. 

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1 hour ago, Wildgoose said:

as Skeeter mentioned there is easy money in that market. Well, easy if you are good and have a quality cutter. Budget cutters don't track very good and can make a mess. 

Yes, there is easy money in this market. I went from a value cutter, to a new Graphtec FC unit,  and had it paid off in less than 6 weeks.  been using this cutter for over 10 years now.  it's a money machine.  :D   I don't scramble to try and sell  100   $5.00 decals a week.. and work my tail off doing it.    I only need to sell a few sets a week.  It works for me. 

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1 hour ago, Wildgoose said:

I have not tried the mask right taper system and they probably work well. I bought the Big Squeegee Cut Vinyl tool and use it for taping off the work. Like anything it takes some learning but after getting used to it taping off long, sometimes WAY LONG cuts are a snap. I have done things in the 14 to 22 foot range. The trick is getting lined up straight so you don't run off the side on your way to the far end. I don't do much cut vinyl anymore but do an occasional big job here and there and as Skeeter mentioned there is easy money in that market. Well, easy if you are good and have a quality cutter. Budget cutters don't track very good and can make a mess. 

 

1 hour ago, MZ SKEETER said:

Yes, there is easy money in this market. I went from a value cutter, to a new Graphtec FC unit,  and had it paid off in less than 6 weeks.  been using this cutter for over 10 years now.  it's a money machine.  :D   I don't scramble to try and sell  100   $5.00 decals a week.. and work my tail off doing it.    I only need to sell a few sets a week.  It works for me. 

How do you go about marketing yourself in your area?  I have been handing out cards and doing social media for right now.

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I am online only.  All shipped..  I don't send out cards. I don't have people call or come to my house.  I live in a very small town, but I can reach millions of potenial buyers.   I have an Ebay store since 2002.  My good service  boosts my ads to the top of searches.  I ship very fast and get great feedback for my quality work.   I sell unique items.  My business sells it's self. 

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I went into it hoping for a ROI in a couple YEARS and was totally new so I was completely learning for months. I did freebies here and there. I remember the days when I got a 10 shirt order and thought it was almost overwhelming and worrisome. I didn't pay myself for my time until I had all my equipment paid for which with the budget machines I bought was actually pretty quickly. I was starting to pick up business from word of mouth and the few people I approached and my budget cutter was a struggle to keep up. I could only cut maybe 8 or 10 copies of a given shirt logo and then I'd have to stop and restart it so the memory wouldn't lock up and stall out. I finally took a leap and financed a new cutter and paid it off in 8 months then stepped up my heat press and paid for it in one 600 shirt order. Never looked back. I have an order for 1000 heat pressed hats and about 1700 shirts that we will be starting into in a couple weeks once the artwork is finalized. Those are all plastisol transfers so it's just a matter of press, flip and press the back. After costs that kind of work generates around $90-$100 per hour. 

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4 minutes ago, Wildgoose said:

I went into it hoping for a ROI in a couple YEARS and was totally new so I was completely learning for months. I did freebies here and there. I remember the days when I got a 10 shirt order and thought it was almost overwhelming and worrisome. I didn't pay myself for my time until I had all my equipment paid for which with the budget machines I bought was actually pretty quickly. I was starting to pick up business from word of mouth and the few people I approached and my budget cutter was a struggle to keep up. I could only cut maybe 8 or 10 copies of a given shirt logo and then I'd have to stop and restart it so the memory wouldn't lock up and stall out. I finally took a leap and financed a new cutter and paid it off in 8 months then stepped up my heat press and paid for it in one 600 shirt order. Never looked back. I have an order for 1000 heat pressed hats and about 1700 shirts that we will be starting into in a couple weeks once the artwork is finalized. Those are all plastisol transfers so it's just a matter of press, flip and press the back. After costs that kind of work generates around $90-$100 per hour. 

So do you sub out to get the transfers or do you do them yourself?  I was looking at a few places to do that in case I get a large order at one point as I do not have room yet to do it. But as soon as my son and daughter-in-law move out I will have 2 rooms for all my equipment.

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18 minutes ago, MZ SKEETER said:

I am online only.  All shipped..  I don't send out cards. I don't have people call or come to my house.  I live in a very small town, but I can reach millions of buyers.   I have an Ebay store since 2002.  My good service  boosts my ads to the top of searches.  I ship very fast and get great feedback for my quality work.   I sell unique items.  My business sells it's self. 

Interesting, so do you also do the plastic signs?

I assume you just cut, put transfer paper on and roll up to ship in a tube.  I just did a few 20x24 for a farm in South Carolina that a friend referred to me plus I have a 10x20 wall decal that is cutting right now that i have to layer and ship to the same people. 

I don't have people come to the house but go to them as I am either going to work or going out at least once a day anyway to pick up one thing or another and just drop it off to them.

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I don't do any signs.  I cut vinyl graphics.  (designs). all outside graphics. .I don't use tubes..  I use   30",    24" x 6" x 6" uline boxes. and smaller. 

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9 minutes ago, MZ SKEETER said:

I don't do any signs.  I cut vinyl graphics.  (designs). all outside graphics. .I don't use tubes..  I use   30",    24" x 6" x 6" uline boxes. and smaller. 

AH Great! I just looked them up. Going to put in a small order for 25.  

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