Go-C Graphics 856 Posted March 20, 2015 I have a neighbor that was part owner of a mobile detailing business. While he was in it he had me make some magnets and shirts for the business. He's no longer a part of the business but his previous partners wants the files I designed to make the shirts and magnets. What do you think? Personally I feel like I sold them magnets and shirts NOT the designs or files. My neighbor really doesn't care because his relationship with his partners went pretty bad so it's not going to create tension between us. It basically comes down to his partner's a cheap ass and wants to take my design to someone cheaper or online like vista print. Just curious what you would do!!!!! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dakotagrafx 7,297 Posted March 20, 2015 if you designed it then charge a design fee and give it to them - if you just traced it then you really don't have much of a claim 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Topper 61 Posted March 20, 2015 You lost the files in a hard disk crash. You will gladly create them again for a fee. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xpaperman 719 Posted March 20, 2015 You lost the files in a hard disk crash. You will gladly create them again for a fee. I works for the Government ..... right? 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Primal Decals 621 Posted March 20, 2015 I wouldnt give it to him if it were me .. since he is that way. if he wants them, then he can get them made from you ,otherwise keep them or charge triple what they should sell for normally.. it comes down to how much will you make off them if they do or dont get them from you and go somewhere else and he says the design is his and has them copied .. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MadHatterGraphix 1,258 Posted March 20, 2015 There are actual factors when it comes to this. 1. Did you charge them a set up fee? If not charge for that. 2. Did they pay you to create new artwork? Charge for that 3. If you had to just trace the image. go to option 1. 4. Do what the Government does just say it was erased. It sounds like all the ex partner is doing is being a complete jerk cause of the fallout between your neighbor and himself. Ask him why he want to outsource when you already have the files, and still can provide the necessary services. I always tell possible clients that yes you can buy online but your supporting a local company, and you don't have to wait a week or so for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted March 20, 2015 Sell them to them for what ever you can get for them. They're not likely going to do you any good otherwise, and probably the only buyer in the market for them is him. No need to be a jerk like the others and cut off your own nose to spite your face. He can't realistically get them from you without your cooperation, right? Why fight him? Trade them for money. 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wildgoose 4,200 Posted March 20, 2015 I'm no lawyer but as I understand it if you actually created a new design for them and they paid you to do so then they would probably have claim on the copyright at least jointly with you. If they didn't pay you for that and you just did it for a friend kind of thing then they would need to pay you for your files. You can't hold hostage their business over it so only your files are what is at stake here since you let them use it for their business look. They now have the right to continue to use that look without compensation but cannot force you to give up the actual files without compensation (assuming they didn't give it to you in the first place). It's the same thing as granting them license to use your artwork on shutter stock etc... IF you actually designed it and didn't specifically give them the copyright then it's still yours. If you copied some idea they came up with then it's less clear but still would be shared and probably still allow you to keep the actual files or at the very least receive compensation at a standard acceptable rate for them. IF you simply converted a pic they had into a vector then you have no copyright at all but STILL can keep your files since they didn't provide them to you. Pay special attention to my signature before making any hasty decisions based on any of my comments because this is just my educated OPINION. No one ever said the law always makes sense and some twisted judge might see things otherwise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
darcshadow 1,626 Posted March 20, 2015 If you're paid to make a design I don't believe that still means the person owns the work you created, it would depend on the contract, if there was a contract. Kind of like a photographer, you pay them to take photos of you, or your event, but they still own the photo and copyright. Some photographers will sell you the copyright, but that's only been a recent development in the industry, and is mostly done by the amateur turned semi-pro photographers. If they guy wants the original art, and is willing to pay for it, I'd sell it to him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Primal Decals 621 Posted March 20, 2015 My buddy had invented a new attachment for dslr cameras just over a year ago , paid someone to design up his logo etc for his business, After finding out that the person wasnt doing thier whole job which was also promoting as well. My friend decided it was time to find a new person,When he asked for the design,they said he couldnt have it ,He paid for someone to create it ,which was different then having it made for him..He contacted a lawyer and the person who designed it had rights to not give it or sell it if they chose not to.So he had to have a new logo made which was actually a good thing in the end for his business .Just me 2 cents.Since my friend had this happen to him.It all falls down to how the design was to be implied,was to be created for or designed for in the contract. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grimey 10 Posted March 20, 2015 If you create a design for a company it is your intellectual property unless you told them you give over the rights to that design. Now if you work at a company as a designer and create a design while working there, then that design belongs to that company. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wildgoose 4,200 Posted March 20, 2015 A lot of it is determined by the original agreement and that would probably be what a court would fall back on and like most have mentioned here, if there wasn't a lot of information in writing then the copyright will fall toward the designer. I read an article about being hired to design a logo and it sounds like there are some laws based around a design that has been "Commissioned" to be done and it gets a little stickier but nonetheless would end up being decided by a court with high dollar lawyers involved. If it was me I would tell them I design logo's all the time and if you want the actual file you have to pay for it. Incidentally I charge $250 for a basic logo job with the stipulation that it includes approximately 8 hours of design time which includes mock-ups and emailing back and forth etc... I let them know up front that if they start to go past the estimate then I will let them know there will be additional fees. I have not yet had to charge more than this. I also give them a thumb drive with their logo in several formats so they will have it for whatever the future brings. Have not had an unsatisfied customer yet. Conversely if I am making shirts or signs for someone and do some custom work in order to facilitate those I factor the drawing time into the job and DON'T give them the files. I typically let them know that they won't get the files ahead of time though. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted March 20, 2015 Were talking mobile detailing business here. It sounds highly unlikely the guy's gonna retain an attorney to file legal action. Get what you can from him for the files, Go-c, and move on. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Go-C Graphics 856 Posted March 20, 2015 Were talking mobile detailing business here.It sounds highly unlikely the guy's gonna retain an attorney to file legal action. Get what you can from him for the files, Go-c, and move on. I'm with you on that. The guys too cheap to pay for anything. Their original order was for 15 shirts. I emailed back and forth to come up with the design and layout. I sold them the shirts for cheaper then I should of: No design fee No setup fee. Later they wanted some magnets so I took the shirt design an arranged it to fit on a magnet and they paid only for the magnets. Over all the design is super easy. Just some text and a clip art thumbs up hand. The problem is I know how to make it, what fonts I used, and he doesn't. He doesn't want to pay someone to recreate it. He wants me to hand it over so that he can just upload it to vista print and buy cheap shirts and magnets. That's one thing I've learned from this forum and just having a business. People come to you because you know how to do it and they don't. And that's why we get paid for what we do. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skarekrow 1,842 Posted March 20, 2015 I'd just sit tight, bide my time, and wait on him. All the while remaining courteous and professional. When it comes down to it, he will either find a way to get it done for free, or pay someone to create something. If the latter happens, you have as good a shot (or better) as any to be the one he pays. He knows you can produce exactly what he wants. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pshawny 410 Posted March 21, 2015 Send him a small 72 dpi file. He will order stuff online and it will look like crap. Sounds like that should serve him right. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cal 393 Posted March 21, 2015 A 72 dpi jpg file... Cal 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
