the graphics lab 2 Posted December 10, 2011 I ordered some Greenstar Aqueous vinyl just to see and figure out contour cutting. It prints pretty well with my 1100 and cuts fine. I laminated it and put it outside and it rained the next day. It looked a little faded but still acceptable. I decided to remove it and the laminate peeled off as if there was no adhesive, taking the ink along with it. I tested a print i kept inside and it is great. So it took some material, half laminated it and submerged it underwater. About 30 minutes later I checked on it and it seems like the aqueous coating is dissolving where there isn't any laminate. I think what happened to my outdoor stickers was water seeped under and dissolved the coating, making the laminate have nothing to hold onto. My question is: are all aqueous coated printable vinyls like this? I am trying to get samples from sihl and mactac, but I just want to make sure they all are not like this before ordering any more. The price of the greenstar seemed a little too good. The photo is: Greenstar UV laminate Greenstar AQ vinyl 30 mil magnetic 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vinylmotivations 143 Posted December 12, 2011 I use the mactac which I order from H&H Sign Supply. About a buck a square foot.... NEVER had this issue. Even have done hundreds of decals for a local high school... their more than happy with them, Also make sure you're using a good quality laminate like 3m, Oracal etc... Mactac also has their own! Avery also has a really cool Aqueous vinyl that has air release channels like the nice wrapping cast stuff does. It is their IPM 2120 and 2121. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shane94 0 Posted December 12, 2011 Wow now i am glad i bought the sihl Basically doing exactly what you are. I used Sihl 3988 with Ouaguard210, it is what everyone said was the "perfect" setup for aqueous printers. We use all epson printers as well with pigment ink. When i first got the sihl i printed off a decal and laminated it then die cut it on my vinyl cutter. I stuck the decal to the top of a plate and put it in the sink under water. Left if their over a day underwater and the decal had no signs of any kind of water damage. Looked brand new still. one suggestion if making outdoor decals cut the graphics twice. Cut it the first time to get the shape of the decal then laminate it. Then cut it again but expand your cut 2-3mm out. That will let you "seal" the graphic with the laminate. Works great Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vinylmotivations 143 Posted December 12, 2011 I wouldn't overcut the lam, if it started peeling, having it hanging off the edge of the actual graphic leaves a small air gap that can effect adhesion if the surface isn't absoultely perfectly clean and free of flaws... so when it starts peeling, not if, it will peel off the graphic as well... I use mactac over the sihl since sihl was never kind enough to send me a sample... anyone willing to help me out? the mactac I hear is thinner anyways and like the print quality.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shane94 0 Posted December 12, 2011 do you use some sealer on the edges then? I was always told on aquous vinal to do it like that or use like some sort of pen sealer around the edge. Maybe its not needed. I have not messed with aquous vinal that long. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the graphics lab 2 Posted December 12, 2011 I appreciate the replies. I put the greenstar aq vinyl with greenstar UV lamiante in the sink, along with aq vinyl with frogjuice on it. I also put a mimaki sample i got fromt he recent AC Sign show. The frogjuice one flaked off very quickly. The greenstar combo looked fine, put when I picked at the lam, it came off with out much trouble. I also tried an overcut on the laminate. I didn't like how that turned out. Hopefully mactac and sihl send me some samples. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vinylmotivations 143 Posted December 12, 2011 Also submerging in water is a bit excessive unless you live in a very very wet climate... physically underwater creates a little bit of hydraulic pressure to make the water want to crawl under the lam, whereas there is nothing forcing say, rain water, under the laminate.... a better example may to be to apply to a shower wall and run water at it for the same length of time... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the graphics lab 2 Posted December 12, 2011 Actually I just spritzed water on it every 30 mins or so. I need to test it on a vertical surface. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
the graphics lab 2 Posted January 25, 2012 Update: If anyone is interested, I got a sample sheet of Sihl 3988. Here is a comparison-greenstar is on the left. There is no laminate on these. They have been up for about 2 weeks and it has rained and snowed. The sihl looks pretty good but the greenstar does not. The greenstar is very cheap, but I think it is only good for indoor use. Even with a laminate it doesn't last very long out side. The color shift could be because the second photos were taken with flash. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shane94 0 Posted January 30, 2012 If you use oraguard210 on the sihl it will do fine. I have some on my car that has been on it 6+ months in rain and sun and it still looks new No fade or anything and yes i agree, the greenstar is not that great, guess thats why its 1/3 the price of sihl. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
