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TruckDriver

Would you be mad?

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Ok, two weeks ago I made 8 double sided signs for a fundraising event here (great success) - didn't charge a dime!!! 

http://forum.uscutter.com/index.php/topic,28095.msg221329.html#msg221329

Last night, as we were walking to our favorite bar, I noticed that one of the signs I made, had been about 75% painted over and written on to advertise the bar.  Now, this bar was the one that put together this fundraiser, but I have to say I was pretty pissed that they re-used my sign for their own profit.

How would you guys feel?  Should I not feel that way?

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if the sign was reuseable for its original intent, ie, a reoccuring annual event and no specific dates were on the sign, then yes. and if/when they came back next time they wouldnt be free.

if it was a one time event, of the signs were marked in a way as to make them unusable for future events, then, wtf? either that or throw them out right? at least their getting some use out of their garbage.

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I wouldn't fret about it. You gave them to them, right.  So, the signs belong to them.  And they were used for their intended purpose initially?  Your part is done, move on.

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They are reusing the sign that was donated so that's their prerogative but why not offer to make them a Professional looking sign for the appropriate fee . . .turn it into an opportunity 

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Don't ever donate and you won't feel that way any more. We never donate materials or labor to fundraising, charity, school, or other types of events. We are a for profit business and we price competitively. If they can get the next guy to donate you save your time and aggravation

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Sounds like a sales opportunity to me... Upsell them to a more permanent substrate and a nicer graphic specific to the bar...... At least they are thinking about a new sign already....and point out the coro is not permanent, only a temporary use sign. It might last at best a year before looking ragged. (Unless you completely cover it with vinyl the coro is gonna UV degrade.... )

Don't get mad about them recycling.. If some folks knew what a coro blank cost us they wouldn't be doing this repainting relettering thing... but we probably don't want them to know either..

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Don't ever donate and you won't feel that way any more. We never donate materials or labor to fundraising, charity, school, or other types of events. We are a for profit business and we price competitively. If they can get the next guy to donate you save your time and aggravation

I'm not gonna lie, I'm going to avoid doing business with you at all costs because you just said that. You sound like a dick.

If you don't have time or money to donate something if they ask, simply tell them that. I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before, but when you do it for a good cause,  it brings a great feeling upon you. Not to mention the amount of word-of-mouth advertising you get from it. I recently donated some shirts to our Special Olympics squad and it turned around and gave me 3 more shirt orders....and the lady in charge of the squad just won't stop bragging about my business....which is great.

outbreak - i think that is a little disrespectful of a business to do so. but like already stated, turn it into an opportunity for preofessional signage.

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Don't ever donate and you won't feel that way any more. We never donate materials or labor to fundraising, charity, school, or other types of events. We are a for profit business and we price competitively. If they can get the next guy to donate you save your time and aggravation

I'm not gonna lie, I'm going to avoid doing business with you at all costs because you just said that. You sound like a dick.

If you don't have time or money to donate something if they ask, simply tell them that. I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before, but when you do it for a good cause,  it brings a great feeling upon you. Not to mention the amount of word-of-mouth advertising you get from it. I recently donated some shirts to our Special Olympics squad and it turned around and gave me 3 more shirt orders....and the lady in charge of the squad just won't stop bragging about my business....which is great.

outbreak - i think that is a little disrespectful of a business to do so. but like already stated, turn it into an opportunity for preofessional signage.

I agree with you Stormy. If you have a successful business and can't find the time or charity to donate every now and then, you ARE a dick.  After all, it's those people out there who made you a success. It's called 'giving something back'.

With an attitude like that, I am surprised they are still in business.

and btw...the odd Freebie I do has always made me much more money and brought me more business eventually than the pittance in time and materials that it cost me.

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Guest kenya

Don't ever donate and you won't feel that way any more. We never donate materials or labor to fundraising, charity, school, or other types of events. We are a for profit business and we price competitively. If they can get the next guy to donate you save your time and aggravation

Are you kidding ?

I totally agree with Stormy..... I would avoid you. Where do you find aggravation in doing something for charity?   ;);D

Hey outbreak, I feel like some of the others- this could be an opportunity to sale a great sign job.

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Don't ever donate and you won't feel that way any more. We never donate materials or labor to fundraising, charity, school, or other types of events. We are a for profit business and we price competitively. If they can get the next guy to donate you save your time and aggravation

and guess who they are gonna go to when they have a paying job? You got it..that next guy.

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.... I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before...

Only about $25K annually of my personal money for handicapped children to get needed dentistry work. But that is personal and not business.

As far as our shop goes we are asked to donate work almost daily and we just don't do it. As i said, we are priced competitively and that is as good as it gets in our shop. How could a charity go wrong buying t-shirts for their event at $5 and selling them for $10 or $15 or even $20? 

As far as a charity goes, I don't have time to investigate what they are about and what they do or even how much of what they bring in goes to the intended purpose.

I may sound like a dick but if the charity wants to make money we can partner with them, but we just don't donate. As far as sounding like a dick, how about the OP? asking if I would be angry over someone reusing a charity sign for a for-profit business? I was only offering a solution to his good work being exploited.

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This might not make me popular here, but I'm no fan of charity.  It denigrates the giver's labor, and the person receiving it gets what they haven't earned.  I don't know about you, but I can feel right about having something I didn't earn.

I very rarely give to charitable events, and I seem to always regret it.  I *will* sometimes trade something of value for free advertising, but if I'm not happy with the value I'm getting, then it being charity won't change my mind.

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This might not make me popular here, but I'm no fan of charity.  It denigrates the giver's labor, and the person receiving it gets what they haven't earned.  I don't know about you, but I can feel right about having something I didn't earn.

I very rarely give to charitable events, and I seem to always regret it.  I *will* sometimes trade something of value for free advertising, but if I'm not happy with the value I'm getting, then it being charity won't change my mind.

.... I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before...

Only about $25K annually of my personal money for handicapped children to get needed dentistry work. But that is personal and not business.

As far as our shop goes we are asked to donate work almost daily and we just don't do it. As i said, we are priced competitively and that is as good as it gets in our shop. How could a charity go wrong buying t-shirts for their event at $5 and selling them for $10 or $15 or even $20? 

As far as a charity goes, I don't have time to investigate what they are about and what they do or even how much of what they bring in goes to the intended purpose.

I may sound like a dick but if the charity wants to make money we can partner with them, but we just don't donate. As far as sounding like a dick, how about the OP? asking if I would be angry over someone reusing a charity sign for a for-profit business? I was only offering a solution to his good work being exploited.

wtf

i disagree with both your statements and if thats the way you feel then why are you on this forum then ? given that this is a form of charity .! we give our time and our service to those who are unable to for whatever reason too do it themselves. so there is no difference between asking for something on here and having some approach you at your business. and at least you know that your not cutting your own throat giving to the competition.

now outbreak as stated before - upsell and remember kama always comes back to those who give freely

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Dang, this is the second thread I started and got people fighting...  That's the last thing I want to do...I was just looking for some input.  What really made me mad was that they painted over my work.  I don't really agree with what they did...maybe I'll have to go back to the bar tonight!  ;)

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Dang, this is the second thread I started and got people fighting...  That's the last thing I want to do...I was just looking for some input.  What really made me mad was that they painted over my work.  I don't really agree with what they did...maybe I'll have to go back to the bar tonight!   ;)

great idea. not trying to start fight just sick of societies " i or me only" attitude . i can also see your anger over what they did too

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This might not make me popular here, but I'm no fan of charity.  It denigrates the giver's labor, and the person receiving it gets what they haven't earned.  I don't know about you, but I can feel right about having something I didn't earn.

I very rarely give to charitable events, and I seem to always regret it.  I *will* sometimes trade something of value for free advertising, but if I'm not happy with the value I'm getting, then it being charity won't change my mind.

.... I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before...

Only about $25K annually of my personal money for handicapped children to get needed dentistry work. But that is personal and not business.

As far as our shop goes we are asked to donate work almost daily and we just don't do it. As i said, we are priced competitively and that is as good as it gets in our shop. How could a charity go wrong buying t-shirts for their event at $5 and selling them for $10 or $15 or even $20? 

As far as a charity goes, I don't have time to investigate what they are about and what they do or even how much of what they bring in goes to the intended purpose.

I may sound like a dick but if the charity wants to make money we can partner with them, but we just don't donate. As far as sounding like a dick, how about the OP? asking if I would be angry over someone reusing a charity sign for a for-profit business? I was only offering a solution to his good work being exploited.

wtf

i disagree with both your statements and if thats the way you feel then why are you on this forum then ? given that this is a form of charity .! we give our time and our service to those who are unable to for whatever reason too do it themselves. so there is no difference between asking for something on here and having some approach you at your business. and at least you know that your not cutting your own throat giving to the competition.

now outbreak as stated before - upsell and remember kama always comes back to those who give freely

;);D ;D

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This might not make me popular here, but I'm no fan of charity.  It denigrates the giver's labor, and the person receiving it gets what they haven't earned.  I don't know about you, but I can feel right about having something I didn't earn.

I very rarely give to charitable events, and I seem to always regret it.  I *will* sometimes trade something of value for free advertising, but if I'm not happy with the value I'm getting, then it being charity won't change my mind.

.... I'm not sure if you've ever donated anything before...

Only about $25K annually of my personal money for handicapped children to get needed dentistry work. But that is personal and not business.

As far as our shop goes we are asked to donate work almost daily and we just don't do it. As i said, we are priced competitively and that is as good as it gets in our shop. How could a charity go wrong buying t-shirts for their event at $5 and selling them for $10 or $15 or even $20? 

As far as a charity goes, I don't have time to investigate what they are about and what they do or even how much of what they bring in goes to the intended purpose.

I may sound like a dick but if the charity wants to make money we can partner with them, but we just don't donate. As far as sounding like a dick, how about the OP? asking if I would be angry over someone reusing a charity sign for a for-profit business? I was only offering a solution to his good work being exploited.

wtf

i disagree with both your statements and if thats the way you feel then why are you on this forum then ? given that this is a form of charity .! we give our time and our service to those who are unable to for whatever reason too do it themselves. so there is no difference between asking for something on here and having some approach you at your business. and at least you know that your not cutting your own throat giving to the competition.

now outbreak as stated before - upsell and remember kama always comes back to those who give freely

Cooperation isn't charity -- I have learned a *lot* from the members on this board, and I do my best to give back to the community here.  There is a huge difference.

I really didn't mean to start a fight here - I 'm just saying how I feel about it, and that I can relate to altruism not ending well for me.

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I dont have any problem doing "charity" work, but its work I decide to do on my own, for friends and such.  If I were to be cold-called or visited at a storefront solely being solicited for charity work, I would likely refuse.  A storefront shop that gets a reputation of freely doing "charity" work can get into big trouble..

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Guest Schramm

Charity in any form is charity!  You should not give a damn what anyone does with what you gave it away once it is gone!  If you start caring about that, then what are you going to do if you give your dad a tie for Fathers day and he takes it back or gives it to you at Christmas?  A gift in any form is just that - a gift!  I give from my mirror business all the time.  I see nothing wrong with a non profit requesting money as there income comes from the community.  The specific charities don't ask more then once a year and so what if 5 or 6 comes your way.  

In a sense if you look at this site as a wealth of information, the people that give you info are contributing to charity as they are not asking for anything in return!  I mean there are brand new people here daily getting answers so that they can join the sign force and honestly I read almost everything here and just shut my mouth with some of the questions as you can tell they are just leaving one thing with no experience.  So damn many people buying plotters to try to become a sign company, t-shirt company and so on with absolutely no experience!

On another NOTE:  I don't know what pricing competitively means honestly as where I come from that means you are the cheapest person on the block and underselling everyone to stay a float.  If you work is of quality and you are a professional company your reputation will earn you a living.  I sit back and shut up an awful lot on forums as I do not like to toss punches but to say your to cheap to give back to your community because you are the low baller screwing honest companies out of honest business is just a big crock.  Learn your job!  What I mean by that is wide spread as if you know what your doing (been professionally trained) and have a pricing schedule (not just friggin flying by the seat of your pants) then by all means cutting your prices is not something you need to do.

As you all know I am not a sign company (I could be - but not enough money in it for me).  Instead I design mirrors, stencils and finishes for furniture and I also sandblast.  I have been a decorative finisher for 27 years now and have been in business for myself for almost 24.  I know my business front and back, I do not really advertise as my business rep speaks for itself.  Why I am telling you this is simple.  I know the economy is bad, I know times are tough but if you are not experienced enough to do your job because you just lost a 10 year job at a meat market and thought "Oh sign making sounds simple...  Then perhaps that would be why you have to price competitively.  I don't care if you only make $1000 per month we all need to give back and charity is almost painless!  You simply give what you can.  There is so many good causes out there to say that you will not give is something I will never understand!

Food for thought - if you are professional and know your job you will never have to say "I price competitively!"

Rob

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Guest Schramm

I dont have any problem doing "charity" work, but its work I decide to do on my own, for friends and such.  If I were to be cold-called or visited at a storefront solely being solicited for charity work, I would likely refuse.  A storefront shop that gets a reputation of freely doing "charity" work can get into big trouble..

Midwaste,

In part I totally agree with you, then in part I see your side but disagree.  Look at it like this...

If a charity comes to you for a freebee, you have every right to say no but what you could do is what I do...

I get almost 50 companies a year calling me, stopping by and so on and what I tell them is this:

I am 100% happy to do the labor part of the work for FREE as long as you can write me a check or a get another donator that will write me a check for the retail part of the materials.  This way you make a little off of the materials, do the charity for free and everyone feels good.

I love doing work for Habitat for Humanity, Make a Wish Foundation and I always donate to St. Jude.  I also love to donate items for auction at events sponsored by the local schools.  For one it is very good advertising for yourself but more then that once you start doing it CARMA takes over (I think someone higher up intervenes) and good things start to happen for you!  Set those good things aside Charity in general just feels good!

Just another way to look at it!

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I've done lots of free or semi-free work for various groups that myself, my family and my friends are involved with, including FIRST robotics, Junior Achievement, MS Foundation, Susan G Komen, youth racing groups, etc. 

However, if I had a storefront and I had someone walk in or I received an unsolicited email, even from a local group, asking for free work, I would doubtfully do it unless they had been referred to me by someone I knew or a group I had worked with in the past.

My point is this: There are thousands and thousands of youth groups, organizations, non-profits, and other worthwhile ventures that are in need of free services/materials.  I can't help all of them and still have time to make money to keep my business afloat.  Yes, there is potential for future paid work.  But there is also potential for getting inundated with requests for "charity" work, as well as creating the impression that you support certain groups and not others. 

I'm all for helping people and groups out, by all means.  However, you have to draw a line between personal "charity" and your business interests, for the sake of the long term.

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Wow, such anger in some responses.  ;) My original response was to not donate if that pisses you off. Now I am attacked because I don't donate goods and services? Go pound sand.

We will partner with any legitimate charity organization to yield both a profit for us and fundraising for them. We even do no-risk plans where they only purchase what they sell. But we do not just give away product. That is all, no more, no less.

A legitimate charity in California has

1) a 501©3 from the SOS in California

2) a sellers permit from the BOE in California and collects or pays sales tax for all sales

3) has a stated purpose for the funds raised and uses the funds for what they state which is required by not-for-profit corps

4) spends or uses 90% of the funds raised within California

If I donate the goods then I have to pay sales tax on them. If they sell them they must collect or pay sales tax on the sale as well. 

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just my .05 cent, the way i look at it, it cost me $1.50 to 20.00, thats just money i could eat out on, but if i help a charity that puts my name out there,my work out there at least for a little bit. as far as them painting over them i gave them the signs or ? it's theirs to do what they will.

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